Massaen Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) Masters The Viktorias – The Viktorias are the melee master of the Outcasts. As a master choice you get 2 models for the price of one with a reasonable defence, a combined wound total of more than any single model in the game at present, 4 general AP plus 2 melee expert, a great CB, nifty trigger for crowd control and the ability to push each other or swap each model. Sounds great huh? It is but it does have its down sides. First up the biggy, no soul stone cache. While this may not sound huge, it is as the Viktorias can’t stack their casting total or combat total for those critical moments. Of course you can afford to leave some from your starting pool but with the relatively high cost of the mercs this can lead to you being outnumbered. Secondly, the Viktorias are limited to just mercs in the crew. The cheapest model is 5 stones, 2 clear of the cheapest in other factions (save for the guild). Lastly, the Viktorias can suffer ‘lone wolf syndrome’ in that with the push mechanic and the companion ability its very easy to over extend them and get them overwhelmed. They need support and if possible 2-4 stones between them. Try saving 6-8 stones and watch just how nasty these chicks can be! Viktoria will benefit from Masks more than any other suit thanks to her combat trigger whirlwind. Her dual focused nature means you have better odds of getting off the spells she casts and the ability to affect both models with any effect makes combining them with the student of conflict particularly nasty. Levicticus – Perhaps the most complex of any master in the game to date, Levicticus is for those of you who have the activation sequence down to an art. The first thing you will notice is that Levicticus is very hard to put down for good. In fact, putting him down is what you want. His unique set of rules mean he cannot draw cards easily without first offing himself. Thankfully, his spells and rules are all geared to do just that. Then once your dead, you respawn next to your friendly Hollow Waif! This means your opponent has to take out both in 1 turn which can be tricky at best. Levicticus can spawn more minions, deal horrific damage with spells and best of all, on a severe in melee, a whopping 12dmg! That alone is enough to keep people away. Like all outcast masters he has no soul stone cache at the building phase without leaving some after buying the crew but even one or 2 can make him a real terror, especially since you don’t need to fear losing him and as such, healing flips using stones are not needed. Levicticus should always have Alyce in his crew due to the extra synergy she brings for him plus she makes a great body guard for the hollow waif. Levicticus is also the cheapest way for the outcasts to summon Killjoy! Levicticus benefits from dual focuses like Viktoria which leads to him having use for multiple high cards unlike other factions masters who tend to require 1 specific suit. His casting trigger will allow you a draw mid turn which lets you filter the deck too some degree. Deaths lessons is of particular note, allowing you to manipulate your attack, casting or damage totals or even stacking the deck to get an extra turn after turn 6! Also remember that you can only hire soulless, undead or constructs but you pay no more for them even if they are out of faction. A rotten belle extends his spells thanks to lure and most undead have a raven in their CB already meaning blessing of desolation is particularly good. Som’er Teeth Jones – Jones is a bit of an odd master in many ways. Firstly, his Crew is restricted to Gremlins, Pigs and Vermin, which means the model range he can select from is extremely limited (two different types of Gremlin, two different types of Pig and a single Vermin). Jones, however, does have ways to bring on extra models during the game; such as a trigger that when killing a model summons a Piglet and a spell that damages a friendly Gremlin but summons another one, which also starts out damaged. All of his minions, excluding the War Pig, tend to be very cheap too but extremely squishy. To make up for this, Jones can also generate more cards upon their death and he can heal them by giving them swigs of moonshine.This all has the effect of turning Jones into a summoning and healing master, where you'll be bringing a lot of models in your Crew anyway, but creating more during the game, healing where possible and trying to take advantage of their inevitable death. Jones himself is pretty tough, with a decent number of wounds, the ability to heal himself without burning stones (his cache is also zero), and a decent offensive potential providing you can get the right triggers off. He also has some built-in negatives, such as a reduced control hand size, the shooting of your own minions if you miss with a ranged attack, etc. The fact that his main damage multiplier or control spell deals wounds to himself, or that to make him fast for a turn you have to take a wound, can be dangerous if misused. He also has a lot more depth than Get yer Bro and Take a Swig. He is predominately a Support Master that has a toolbox instead of one specialized function. Using him to the utmost is about managing his WD's and playing cat and mouse. In a straight up fight he will lose, however using Sooey! and Pork Whisper'n he can quickly redeploy and control his Pork muscle. A gremlins luck gives the ability to influence your opponents cheating while a Dumb luck Boomer strike can inflict up to 10 DG in one hit (though Som'er will incur 5 WD's himself). His largest obstacle is Ill-fated, however, with the synergy in his crew this is mitigated somewhat. His lack of cache is also a potential issue, though he has ways of mitigating that thru the aforementioned spaming of Get yer Bro and Come and Get it! (Both of which allow him to summon additional models) and by using other models in his crew. Minions Bishop – Personally, I find bishop underwhelming. The biggest issue is the choice of adaptive fighter or cage fighter since both are (0) actions and can’t be used at the same time. This combined with a slow WK/CG, low damage and huge cost mean that he tends to not pull his weight. His redeeming features seem to be the triggers he has (one for every suit at least) plus his charge only costing (1). It’s unfortunate that for his price, you can have 2 ronin which are twice as good as he is… What is interesting is this model seems to bring the most opposed views from outcast players. It has been said he is something of a giant killer - It doesn't matter how big they are, his damage is constant. What happens when you charge killjoy with him, choke him so he's slow. Cage Fighter for defence and then defensive stance? If he hits you, odds say he misses. If he trys to walk away, unless you black the free strike, he's staying put. Also - given a high ram, you can just shut him down with paralyse. Or say you're up against something with a lower CB, like a warpig. Charge it; hopefully slow it, defensive stance and adaptive fighter for masks. If it misses, you leap out. Giant killing aside, have you ever tried to take treasure from bishop? At 8Df, defensive stanced bishop takes far too much to kill. Also - against ressurectionist masters, who all have hard to kill and other horrible abilities, which rely on soaking damage and having low DF. Study opponent on them, and then adaptive fighter tomes - putting himself on +1/2 flips on seamus is not to be sniffed at. 4 Damage is still 1/3 of his health. Not to mention the fact that he could possibly drop a high ram and force him to bleed soulstones or spend the rest of the game paralysed. High damage throughput isn't the point; you have other models to do that with. His purpose is to be a swiss army knife. He doesnt care about suits, and just gets better with access to the right ones. He can keep the Viktorias/your other glass cannons like Misaki/Ronin alive by locking bruisers in combat, and he’s the best damn treasure holder in the entire game. The only thing stopping him from completely breaking is that this game doesn’t have a front/back arc. Convict Gun Slinger – I have yet to hear one person not like this guy. Paired weapon, good CB, cheap, fairly durable… what’s not to like? Thing is – this all pales in comparison to his action ‘Suppressive Fire’. In a game where card control is the key, the ability to make your opponent play a card on each model affected before it activates is huge. If you have played a 12 or 13 on the cast, watch your opponent squirm. Of course he should activate early in the turn to maximise this unique ability and combined with a model with a trigger like head shot or decapitate can make for a truly deadly combo. Hans – The merc sniper. See that word? The third one…sniper. That one word conjures up all sorts of things in a player’s head. The lone wolf shooting from a mile away and killing with that one shot. Hans is kind of half there. Range wise he ties with Nino from the guild at a whopping 16”. I find it interesting that a repeating rifle has the same range as a custom sniper rifle but hey… the boards not that big. He ignores a good deal of the targeting rules thanks to sniper and his goggles, which means you need blocking terrain to really escape him. Thing is, his damage is on the low side (Bishop punches as hard!) so when you do get a hit it’s not that good. The Custom ammo is hard to cast and does not do that much to help him. Even critical strike is not built in like the guild. His only really threatening attack is headshot. If you have that 13 of rams (or the red joker) then your set… especially if the convict fired first! Just draw out your opponent’s cards and BAM! Hans is a little on the high side cost wise for his limited application but in the bigger games (35+) he can be great. Taelor – Lady Hammerstrike. My god I love having her in my crew. Hard to wound and hard to kill with a good amount of wounds and an average defence means she can take a pounding and keep coming. A great reach on her runic hammer combined with good damage and ignore armour make her a power house. Facing constructs she gets even nastier. She is a touch on the slow side and costs nearly the same as bishop but these are minor issues compared to the pain she brings. Johan – I have come around to liking Johan. At first I wrote him off as a poor version of Taelor until I realised he does just as much damage with almost the same stats, though he is easier to kill but he is only 75% of the cost! The 2 of them working together is truly dangerous – easily capable of taking out just about any enemy. Johan also has the bonus that an MSU member boosts him even more! Run him with Ramos and watch the heads roll! Like Taelor, he ignores armour, excellent reach and damage but also comes with flurry (i prefer tailor with melee expert myself but this works in a pinch) plus hard to kill and slow to die. He can take some killing let me tell you! Misaki – The samurai ninja chick. At a glance she looks great. Good speed, great weapon and CB. A little on the weak side, durability wise. Her spells are great but hard to cast due to the varied suits unless you have the cards in your hand. I would have liked 1 of the (0) spells to be an action but for her cost I guess I can’t complain. Of note is the wind spell which gives her a whopping 6” reach! When combined with her good move and melee expert she can have a huge threat range… Plus the model is cool! Foresight is also an interesting little ability which while a little situational, can give her an edge in a tight dual. Killjoy – After putting him on the table recently I can only say WOW. While you do need to sacrifice a model to summon him (Levicticus is obvious but any cheap model will do – taking Hamelin with a gremlin can work) he is horrific to face. Hard to wound 2, 12 wounds makes him tough but its eat your fill combined with his horrific damage output and free walk if he is not engaged that make him shine. His biggest down sides apart from the sacrifice are his low DEF and the requirement to discard a control card to active him. I tend to activate him early just so I remember to do the discard since failure to do so can lead to my opponent activating him! He is a little pricey so he might be better held until 35+SS games... Hamelin – I think Hamelin is the closest thing that the outcasts have to a table manipulation caster. With 3 superb spells combined with a repeat trigger and great range mean he can deplete an opponent’s hand quickly. His 2 unique rules regarding height 1 models mean he shines against these opponents as they cannot target him, but watch out for blasts or pulses which get around this (exploding spiders for example). He can also hire any height 1 model. This is mixed due to the extra cost of these models if they are out of faction. What you CAN do though, is use it to hire gremlins for the Viktorias in a scrap. This may sound odd but can lead to some very interesting things taking place... Alyce – She is a MUST for Levicticus. Period. I almost consider her a must for Ramos as well. Bag of tricks is great to foil charges, inflict damage in a messy fight. Headshot keeps your opponent on their toes. The fact she gets extra cards in your hand with either of the 2 masters which can take her is a bonus. She can be a touch easy to take out but the extra range on her pistol can keep her out of trouble. She is also a great secondary caster to the master, utilising cards of a suit not used by the primary master in some cases. Ronin – Cheap, Nasty, Fast. That pretty much covers it. Run through is especially nasty due to the speed which you can cover ground. Harmless and hard to kill make them take at least a couple of hits before they go down. In a real bind and surrounded, the +2 DEF and defensive stance can keep you going longer than expected. Their weapon is great with the + twist but their CB of 5 means a master is generally out of their reach to kill. Having said that, anything else is fair game. With the Viktorias – bring a couple... Steampunk Abomination – Relatively weak but with some interesting twists. You take damage just from being near them and they get free pushes when in base to base with other constructs. With 4 of them you can burn 4 activations with lots of pushes and then summon the Desolation engine and activate it – 5 activations WITHOUT using Levicticus, the Hollow Waif or Alyce and thats in a 20SS game! Just crazy.... Desolation Engine – Once it’s in combat it should be fine. Good CB, Paired and good damage mean that even with unstable it should be fine. Personally though, i think hiring steam punk abominations and using the free pushes up the table then summoning the engine work better than simply including it in the starting crew. Bayou Gremlin – Another toolbox model in the Gremlin crew, they can deal decent DG thru the use of Dumb luck or Y'all watch this (and with well placed blasts get around higher DF), though the Gremlin tends not to survive after Dumb luck and will be Sac'd after Y'all watch this. The Flip for it spell and Focused attacks somewhat mitigate the risks associated with the Gremlin Boomstick attacks and compensate for their low CB. In the event you find your Bayou Gremlins in melee (a place they definately should not be) then Reckless Abandon and the squeel! trigger can provide some assistance in either dealing DG with the Rusty Weapons they carry (should they survive to use them) or help them survive for another round by getting out of combat. One of the often over looked abilities of the Bayou Gremlins is Deliverance, though Terrifying 11 isn't super great it does give a way around the Harmless defense, and can be used as another mechanic to burn your opponents draw deck. In summation they tend to work best when used in packs, and a Gremlin Gun Line can do a surpising amount of DG (or with bad flips destroy itself). Like the rest of the Gremlin crew cat and mouse games go a long way toward getting them the win. Hog Whisperer – A support model for the Pigs pure and simple. They (along with the Skeeters and So'mer) are the driving force behind the speed and mobility of the Pig Boomerang. Judicious use of Sooey (from this model, So'mer and the Skeeters) and never happen... can move a squadron of Pigs (both spells effect all friendly Pigs within range) half way up the board before their activation allowing stampeded pigcharges deep into the enemy lines with little risk of losing your own models, then return them to safety for another launch next round. The two 0 actions on this model provide decent insuruance against errant Pigcharges killing your own models. Survival of the fittest is a nice extra when you are close enough to dying Gremlins to benefit (though remember you can only use one instance of SotF per Gremlin Death regardless of how many models with the ability are within 6"). Piglet – The easier unit of the Som'er teeth crew to use. They're decent because they're spammable but lack the lasting power of the Warpig. However, for very cheap, it's fast at 10" Cg, does 2 damage at weak with Pigcharge with +1 to the damage flip and 2 helpful triggers. Pigcharges are pushes so allow these models to freely leave melee combat. Also if the pigs are flying they will allow you to bypass screening models to get at the heart of the enemy during these pushes. Judicious use of Reckless fast can give piglets a surprising threat range and DG potential (Reckless Fast can be used even when the Pigs are Stampeding). Lastly, models with the Pig characteristic dont have to fear being the target of a stampeding pig, so use them in squadrons of 3 or more. Warpig – What applies to the Piglets generally applies to their bigger brother. The key difference is the base size, being on a large base they can block LOS to models which may be closer than the ones you want to attack (or friendlies) giving a small bit of control during stampedes. They also have a few situational abilities that are neat, such as the Truffle spell which can move a misplaced freindly Gremlin, or Eat anything which removes all Scrap and Corpse tokens within its range healing the Warpig 2 WD's per counter removed (still some debate on whether models leave these tokens if there are no Graverobbers or Scavengers on the field). Student of Conflict – Mixed thoughts here. He is great for the Viktorias since you can affect both but with his slow movement, and (+1) fast being an ALL action, generally yuou will only get 1 or 2 uses per game. One thing i have enjoyed is using him beside the convict gun slinger or hans – fact at range is great (just ask perdita!) Malifaux Child – hmmm... Hollow Waif – Nothing more than a respawn point for Levicticus. He is free though! Easy to kill so needs to be protected (Alyce is good for this) but he needs to live to keep the recycle of Levicticus going. Giant Mosquito – Though the characteristic change from Gremlin to Vermin did eleminate an "Easy button" for the Gremlin Crews it also streamlined their role within the crew. Along with Som'er and the Hog Whisperers this model can cast Sooey! which allows the pigs to be boomeranged around the board and greatly enhances the Pigs threat range. A pair of them can move anywhere on the board and set up your pig squadrons. Parasitic Infection can work miracles against the Resurectionist cannon fodder (on a successful cast you can almost guarantee that troublesome Flesh Construct or Killjoy will go bye bye). Another significant point is that due to the characteristic change from Gremlin to Vermin, Skeeters can now damage other skeeters with Pull my finger attacks (though thankfully the one who casts it won’t) so careful placement when attempting the skeeter Stank Cloud is a must. Lastly, though Som'er can bond up to four, two tends to be his best number (at least until they start making more). Two mosquitoes is the optimum starting number, but I thought I'd clarify why. Buying all four mosquitoes at the start of the game is a waste. Mosquitoes and gremlins are the same soul stone cost, so the more mosquitoes you have to summon with larvae, the better. The reason being that (so long as you have at least one mosquito) you can sacrifice a gremlin to summon another mosquito. This is superior to just buying a mosquito before the game because the gremlin you lost didn't cost you anymore than the mosquito and it netted you two cards when it died. And maybe you were able to activate it first and get some use out of it. So, now you may be wondering, why have two mosquitoes? Why not just one? The answer to that is souey. You want at least one mosquito that can use one AP to move up field 10" and another AP to cast souey and net all your pigs extra movement (which you get even if you fail this spell). Obviously, a summoned mosquito couldn't accomplish this since it is slow. Edited January 3, 2010 by Massaen updated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n0signal Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 Som'er Teeth Jones - Jones is a bit of an odd master in many ways. Firstly, his Crew is restricted to Gremlins, Pigs and Vermin, which means the model range he can select from is extremely limited (two different types of Gremlin, two different types of Pig and a single Vermin). Jones, however, does have ways to bring on extra models during the game; such as a trigger that when killing a model summons a Piglet and a spell that damages a friendly Gremlin but summons another one, which also starts out damaged. All of his minions, excluding the War Pig, tend to be very cheap too but extremely squishy. To make up for this, Jones can also generate more cards upon their death and he can heal them by giving them swigs of moonshine. This all has the effect of turning Jones into a summoning and healing master, where you'll be bringing a lot of models in your Crew anyway, but creating more during the game, healing where possible and trying to take advantage of their inevitable death. Jones himself is pretty tough, with a decent number of wounds, the ability to heal himself without burning stones (his cache is also zero), and a decent offensive potential providing you can get the right triggers off. He also has some built-in negatives, such as a reduced control hand size, the shooting of your own minions if you miss with a ranged attack, etc. The fact that his main damage multiplier or control spell deals wounds to himself, or that to make him fast for a turn you have to take a wound, can be dangerous if misused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omadon Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 Hm. Alot to add here, as I main the Viktorias/Levi. EDIT: I appologise in advance for the rambling, tangent-in-a-tangent nature of this. I get distracted easily Reguarding the Viktorias - it should be noted that you just flat take the Student of Conflict (Which is 3SS ) The fact that you can stack haste on one that's already activated, and then drop it on another one the next turn can lead to planting a fully bluffed, 3AP/ME1 dual weilding viktoria in the middle of the opponent's models. Also - from experience. Always, always take as many soulstones as you possibly can, and use them liberaly. It's almost certain that any ammount of focused attention will kill one viktoria, so I'd recommend the dual weilder as the most amazing glass cannon the game has ever known. That said - pray your opponent doesnt get assassinate, and never, eevveerr use bodyguard on them ^^ Made that mistake too many times. Also, one thing to bear in mind, in reugard to treasure hunt - it's really, really easy to grab the treasure with them, due to their slingshot capacity, but making them hold it is a waste. If you get the oppertunity, hand it to something else (Bishop is perfect for this). Furthermore - one thing that nobody seems to mention, is what suit coverage they have. If you're playing the Viktorias, try not to take much else that wants masks, cos as soon as she hits combat, her whirlwind is terrifying. Other than that - they don't need any other suits really, so you're free to do what you like with the rest of the army. Reguarding Leveticus - Quite possibly my faveourite model in any miniature game, ever. The first thing I'm toing to mention here is his suit coverage. Dual focused is probably the least noticed, but best of his abilitys. All pure casters in this game require highs of specific suits, but he gives you a solid use for Ravens and Tomes. That in itself makes him a powerhouse. His draw capacity can be deceptive too. When readng that you don't draw cards as normal, do remember that he's probably going to draw at least two cards off of disciplined caster (A single tome trigger off any of his spells that makes him draw a card) and another two from Alyce. The fact that he can't draw cards naturally just stops him from flat breaking. Also - a couple things I've picked up from playing. The frist of which is that Death's Lessons is one of the most abusable spells ever made (It's also not a spell, and thus has no CC ) Any point you see a card you like, you can either make sure it's the next spell you get or, if you have a 7 of tomes/ravens in hand, you can put something random on top, stack the card you want, blessings of desolation something and draw from disciplined caster. It also makes him alot more reliable in close combat, as he's one of the few models that knows what he's going to soulstone into. If you're holding something high, and you see another high card, stack something random on top of it, drop a high card from your hand and soulstone into whatever you want. Or, if you don't see anything, you know not to blow a soulstone on a doomed attack. The last thing of note from Death's Lessons is it's ability to control the end of a game. Often I've burnt out opposing activations on turn six with abominations/whatever so that I get the last activation, and then used lessons to either end the game then and there or push for another turn. Also - I can't quite be bothered to find the quote, but it's been mentioned for an upcoming FAQ that the rule which states that you can't attack you're own master is being done away with (BAHAHAAHAHAahaAh!1!) Which really allows you to plan for your turn. Activating Levi early to avoid him getting picked off, and to maximize on his buffs/card draw, as losing him early is a problem due to how purposfully fragile he is. And while he is ment to die, you only have so many turns with which to abuse him. Wall of text aside, I often look at my hand at the start of the turn, and depending on Levi's remaining WD and the size of my hand/what I see off lessons weather or not I want him to die, but on occasion - getting that wrong, and comitting more than I wanted to keeping something alive/killing something can often lead to revising that descision late into the turn, so for that reason I'd recommend keeping Alyce til late - as not only can she headshot later on, she can also just devote one of her rapidfire attacks/boobytraps to finishing levi off. Hm, shall come back to him later, I have alot to say reguarding his spells Bishop - right, have you people actually read biship? Hoolly piss he's amazing. Does lack punch!? He doesnt need it! Bishop has a very specific purpose - he's a giant killer. It doesn't matter how big they are, his damage is constant. What happens when you charge killjoy with him, choke him so he's slow. Cage Fighter for defence and then defensive stance? If he hits you, odds say he misses. If he trys to walk away, unless you black the free strike, he's staying put. Also - given a high ram, you can just shut him down with a paralize. Or say you're up against something with a lower CB, like a warpig. Charge it, hopefully slow it, defensive stance and adaptive fighter for masks. If it misses, you leap out. I actually rode a pig all the way back to jones one game ^^ Giantkilling aside, have you ever tried to take treasure from bishop? and 8Df, defensive stanced bishop takes faarr too much to kill. Also - against ressurectionist masters, who all have hard to kill and other horrible abilitys, who rely on soaking damage and having low DF. Study opponent on them, and then adaptive fighter tomes - I suppose this still does come under giantkilling, butyeah - putting himself on +1/2 flips on seamus is not to be sniffed at. 4 Damage is still 1/3 of his health. Not to mention the fact that he could possibly drop a high ram and force him to bleed soulstones or spend the rest of the game paralized. Long story short, bishop kicks ass. High damage throughput isn't the point, you have other models to do that with (And if you want him to do damage, try fighting him on high places Toss Aside = fall damage ^^) His purpose is to be a swiss army knife. He doesnt care about suits, and just gets better with access to the right ones. He can keep the Viktorias/your other glass cannons like Misaki/Rhonin alive by locking bruisers in combat, and hes the best damn treasure holder in the entire game. The only thing stopping him from compleatly breaking is that this game doesnt have a front/back arc. More later <3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southpaw Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 More later <3 What? NO!!!! I hate cliff hangers :hangman: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acid_gaming Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 Good work lads, Keep it coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raintar Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 I'm going to give my own opinions for a second opinions on the units, mostly because I have the time to do so. The Viktorias – Basically, their main advantages are that they are two instead of one obviously and also you can do some pretty neat tricks with Sisters in Spirit for both effects, overall a pretty good master, though she has no base soulstones which can be rather frustrating. Levictus – Can absolutely STOMP things. Is very weak against fast units, that can kill his waifs but if you can work him correctly he can do great things. Som’er Teeth Jones – An interesting master, the best thing that I've seen him do that far is spam Get Y'er Bro and Take a Swig, not so bad considering you are spamming out guys, that can in turn keep your Pigs alive. Minions Bishop – A skill unit, you need to know what you're doing to use him correctly and he can be a powerhouse. He can pick off units pretty easily. Plus by using a Walk then a one action charge he moves 4+7=11 inches a turn, which is pretty damn fast. His Study opponent is key, Bishop isn't made be a unit to kill every opposing unit on the board but he get do some serious damage given to a skilled player. Convict Gun Slinger – What's not to say, if you're not paying 6 for him, he drives a hard bargain. He's paired Cb 6, 2 fantastic triggers, rapid fire, Ruthless, Gunfighter, and even his spell is good, use him! *Hans- I feel like this unit doesn't have the firepowerto make his 8 points worth it. Sure it has fantastic range but with Cb 5 custom Ammunition a long shot needing a 7RAM or higher, and his damage being 1/2/4, I feel like his only use would be in strategies in hand advantage where you force them to discard cards. Cb 5 means you won't beat their defense by alot so it will be a damage flip at -1 flip which with damage 1 weak 2 moderate, it isn't looking good at all. Taelor – Obviously good range which has huge advantages, but I think it's only ok for an 8 point model. Sure it's Hard to wound and kill with melee expert and ignores armor and terrifying but I feel like she's very vanilla and I feel that a unit can be better picked to fit a more specialized role for the cost. Johan- Very cheap for what it brings. Three damage at weak is nothing to sneeze at, especially at 3 range and ignores armor. Add in Flurry, Hard to Kill, Slow to Die, 8 wounds and 2 good triggers and this unit is almost as cost effective as the gunslinger, maybe even more! Misaki – Foresight is MUCH better then people give it credit for. Combine it with a decent range, her problem is that you need a specific suit for anything cool that you want to do. Melee expert is great, her trigger is good. If you have a hand that you're willing to use on her, she can be very good good if not, she may not be worth it. Killjoy – Absolute monster. Get him out and he's just killing machine. If you can find a good way of getting him out like using a Hollow Waif or Nicodem's Vulture. He can pay dividends. Hamelin – Pretty annoying, especially if it's opponent is playing models with a low Wp. Can straight out kill units with good enough flipping, and also usually leaves a huge dent in your opponents hand because they won't want to charge their own units, which also hurts their forward progress towards Haemlin. He's also a casting expert and has a fantastic trigger. Alyce – GREAT if you can use her. Highly recommend her with any model that can use her Something to Live for ability even Ramos. You get a decent fighter who can protect models with her Bag of Tricks and also lets you draw 2 extra cards win-win win-sold. Ronin – I've already preached in a 6 page thread how this unit is the best in the game. I don't need to get into it any further. Knowing how to use them is key. *Steampunk Abomination – With 3 Cb he won't be hitting much, and even if he does, he wont do much damage anyway. Makes his Consuming Touch ability rather weak and the Desolate Warping a reach. Keep pace is pretty good to keep next to a Desolation engine though, using move actions on the engine you can move the engine, and use keep pace to move your SA's next to enemy models alot better for some extra attacks. *Desolation Engine – Seems pretty nasty, though I've never used it. Paired Cb 6 with Consuming Touch is a pretty good combo, even with Unstable creation. Melee expert makes it great, but it needs alot of support from Levy who needs to be making them non-stop to build more and keep up. Bayou Gremlin – Spammable nukeboxes. And when they die you draw cards due to the Hog Whisperers ability. Always cool, just make sure you can hit....Y'all watch this is your friend, if you can use the trigger and do 4 damage at weak with a two point model that's a win in my book. Hog Whisperer – Great for Pig controlling, reactivate is an obvious plus. Sooey! and Stik'm in the Ass is a fantastic combo and survival of the fittest is really good too. Piglet – The easier unit of the Som'er teeth crew to use. Charge blah blah charge yeah whatever. They're decent because they're spammable but lack the lasting power of the Warpig. However, for very cheap, it's fast at 10" Cg, does 2 damage at weak with Pigcharge with +1 to the damage flip and 2 helpful triggers. Warpig – He will be a target any way you look at it so make sure he's healthy. He's not the one that should be charging up and leading the way, that is' unless you know for sure it can use Eat your Fill. Student of Conflict – Obviously has it's uses, great for units that will be running up for that extra attack or action, since you really can't hold it next to one unit all game. *Malifaux Child – Paired and Harmless but who are you kidding, take the two soulstones. Hollow Waif – Keep them alive! Nothing more to it, make sure he's less then 9" from Rusty Alyce so you can draw back when you revive and obviously less then 10" at all times from Levy. *Giant Mosquito – Since the errata changed it from a Gremlin to a Vermin the value of this unit went from decent to nil. If you somehow make it to an enemy you can waste a 13 from your hand or get absurdly lucky to kill the enemy granted that they don't resist and stop it with your abysmal 2 Ca. *Marks units I haven't used or seen used play in game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 (edited) *Giant Mosquito – Since the errata changed it from a Gremlin to a Vermin the value of this unit went from decent to nil. If you somehow make it to an enemy you can waste a 13 from your hand or get absurdly lucky to kill the enemy granted that they don't resist and stop it with your abysmal 2 Ca. *Marks units I haven't used or seen used play in game Well, until the FAQ comes out, if you have two giant mosquitoes next to each other, they have infinite movement and, once they get where they are going, they can still make an (all) action. And sommer teeth can ditch his opponent's fate hand. So the only real question about pulling off parasitic infection is whether you have the cards you need in your hand. That's not even mentioning that they're df 7 and sommer's healing can have them at six wounds. And you can take four of them. And they can sling shot your pigs. Yeah...they good. Edited December 28, 2009 by Justin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raintar Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Well, until the FAQ comes out, if you have two giant mosquitoes next to each other, they have infinite movement and, once they get where they are going, they can still make an (all) action. And sommer teeth can ditch his opponent's fate hand. So the only real question about pulling off parasitic infection is whether you have the cards you need in your hand. That's not even mentioning that they're df 7 and sommer's healing can have them at six wounds. And you can take four of them. And they can sling shot your pigs. How do they have infinite movement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omenbringer Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 (edited) Som’er Teeth Jones – An interesting master, the best thing that I've seen him do that far is spam Get Y'er Bro and Take a Swig, not so bad considering you are spamming out guys, that can in turn keep your Pigs alive. Minions Bayou Gremlin – Spammable nukeboxes. And when they die you draw cards due to the Hog Whisperers ability. Always cool, just make sure you can hit....Y'all watch this is your friend, if you can use the trigger and do 4 damage at weak with a two point model that's a win in my book. Hog Whisperer – Great for Pig controlling, reactivate is an obvious plus. Sooey! and Stik'm in the Ass is a fantastic combo and survival of the fittest is really good too. Piglet – The easier unit of the Som'er teeth crew to use. Charge blah blah charge yeah whatever. They're decent because they're spammable but lack the lasting power of the Warpig. However, for very cheap, it's fast at 10" Cg, does 2 damage at weak with Pigcharge with +1 to the damage flip and 2 helpful triggers. Warpig – He will be a target any way you look at it so make sure he's healthy. He's not the one that should be charging up and leading the way, that is' unless you know for sure it can use Eat your Fill. *Giant Mosquito – Since the errata changed it from a Gremlin to a Vermin the value of this unit went from decent to nil. If you somehow make it to an enemy you can waste a 13 from your hand or get absurdly lucky to kill the enemy granted that they don't resist and stop it with your abysmal 2 Ca. My additions to these. Som'er has a lot more depth than Get yer Bro and Take a Swig. He is predominately a Support Master that has a toolbox instead of one specialized function. Using him to the utmost is about managing his WD's and playing cat and mouse. In a straight up fight he will lose, however using Sooey! and Pork Whisper'n he can quickly redeploy and control his Pork muscle. A gremlins luck gives the ability to influence your opponents cheating while a Dumb luck Boomer strike can inflict up to 10 DG in one hit (though Som'er will incure 5 WD's himself). His largest obstacle is Ill-fated, however, with the synergy in his crew this is mitigated somewhat. His lack of cache is also a potential issue, though he has ways of mitigating that thru the aforementioned spaming of Get yer Bro and Come and Get it! (Both of which allow him to summon additional models) and by using other models in his crew. Bayou Gremlins are another toolbox model in the Gremlin crew, they can deal decent DG thru the use of Dumb luck or Y'all watch this (and with well placed blasts get around higher DF), though the Gremlin tends not to survive after Dumb luck and will be Sac'd after Y'all watch this. The Flip for it spell and Focused attacks somewhat mitigate the risks associated with the Gremlin Boomstick attacks and compensate for their low CB. In the event you find your Bayou Gremlins in melee (a place they definately should not be) then Reckless Abandon and the squeel! trigger can provide some assistance in either dealing DG with the Rusty Weapons they carry (should they survive to use them) or help them survive for another round by getting out of combat. One of the often over looked abilities of the Bayou Gremlins is Deliverance, though Terrifying 11 isn't super great it does give a way around the Harmless defense, and can be used as another mechanic to burn your opponents draw deck. In summation they tend to work best when used in packs, and a Gremlin Gun Line can do a surpising amount of DG (or with bad flips destroy it self). Like the rest of the Gremlin crew cat and mouse games go along way toward getting them the win. The Hog Whisperer is a support model for the Pigs pure and simple. They (along with the Skeeters and So'mer) are the driving force behind the speed and mobility of the Pig Boomerang. Judicius use of Sooey (from this model, So'mer and the Skeeters) and never happen... can move a squadron of Pigs (both spells effect all friendly Pigs within range) half way up the board before their activation allowing stampeded pigcharges deep into the enemy lines with little risk of losing your own models, then return them to safety for another launch next round. The two 0 actions on this model provide decent insuruance against errant Pigcharges killing your own models. Survival of the fittest is a nice extra when you are close enough to dying Gremlins to benefit (though remember you can only use one instance of SotF per Gremlin Death regardless of how many models with the ability are within 6"). Piglets, generally agree with what was stated by Raintar, though will add that Pigcharges are pushes so allow these models to freely leave melee combat. Also if the pigs are flying they will allow you to bypass screening models to get at the heart of the enemy during these pushes. Judicious use of Reckless fast can give piglets a surprising threat range and DG potential (Reckless Fast can be used even when the Pigs are Stampeding). Lastly, models with the Pig characteristic dont have to fear being the target of a stampeding pig, so use them in squadrons of 3 or more. Warpigs, what applies to the Piglets generally applies to their bigger brother. The key difference is the base size, being on a large base they can block LOS to models which may be closer then the ones you want to attack (or friendlies) giving a small bit of control during stampedes. They also have a few situational abilities that are neat, such as the Truffle spell which can move a misplaced freindly Gremlin, or Eat anything which removes all Scrap and Corpse tokens within its range healing the Warpig 2 WD's per counter removed (still some debate on whether models leave these tokens if there are no Graverobbers or Scavengers on the field). Giant Mosquitos, though the characteristic change from Gremlin to Vermin did eleminate an "Easy button" for the Gremlin Crews it also streamlined their role within the crew. Along with Som'er and the Hog Whisperers this model can cast Sooey! which allows the pigs to be boomeranged around the board and greatly enhances the Pigs threat range. As was mentioned by Lalochezia a pair of them can move anywhere on the board and set up your pig squadrons. Parasitic Infection can work miracles against the Resurectionist cannon fodder (on a successful cast you can almost guruantee that troublesome Flesh Construct or Killjoy will go bye bye). Another significant point is that due to the characteristic change from Gremlin to Vermin, Skeeters can now damage other skeeters with Pull my finger attacks (though thankfully the one who casts it wont) so careful placement when attempting the skeeter Stank Cloud is a must. Lastly, though Som'er can bond upto four, two tends to be his best number (at least until they start making more). The above models tend to work best (at their full potential) when used together. Other Masters dont really get much use out them largely due to the increased SS cost per model. With any of these models WP duels are best avoided at all costs. Lastly, with all the above models except Som'er and the Warpig, fear Hamelin, his Bully ability coupled with Growing Influence and his Spells can reek havoc on your plans. Edited December 29, 2009 by Omenbringer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omenbringer Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 How do they have infinite movement? They can sac and place each other indefinately using Larva since currently a model that is suffering from Slow can still use All actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raintar Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 From my understanding, an "All" action requires ALL of your actions which is impossible due to slow that you receive from being summoned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paperbag4 Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 It requires all your actions for that turn, there's not a numerical amount. Just like how a model with Fast couldn't use an (All) action and then a (1) action, a model with Slow loses a (1) action, but still has actions for that turn, thus they still have the ability to perform an (All) action Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omenbringer Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 You would think, though Page 44 of the book says "If a model performs an (All) Action, it is the only action that model may take during its activation." Until a FAQ changes that, models that are effected by Slow (as an example those just Summoned) can still use there All actions as there is no AP requirement other then having them to use. So Skeeters can use their Larva action ad nasuem. Paperbag4 beat me to it and said it better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massaen Posted December 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Thanks for the feedback so far guys! I will update the main post shortly... plus give my own expanded thoughts, especially on Bishop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 My additions to these. Som'er has a lot more depth than Get yer Bro and Take a Swig. He is predominately a Support Master that has a toolbox instead of one specialized function. Using him to the utmost is about managing his WD's and playing cat and mouse. In a straight up fight he will lose, however using Sooey! and Pork Whisper'n he can quickly redeploy and control his Pork muscle. A gremlins luck gives the ability to influence your opponents cheating while a Dumb luck Boomer strike can inflict up to 10 DG in one hit (though Som'er will incure 5 WD's himself). His largest obstacle is Ill-fated, however, with the synergy in his crew this is mitigated somewhat. His lack of cache is also a potential issue, though he has ways of mitigating that thru the aforementioned spaming of Get yer Bro and Come and Get it! (Both of which allow him to summon additional models) and by using other models in his crew. Bayou Gremlins are another toolbox model in the Gremlin crew, they can deal decent DG thru the use of Dumb luck or Y'all watch this (and with well placed blasts get around higher DF), though the Gremlin tends not to survive after Dumb luck and will be Sac'd after Y'all watch this. The Flip for it spell and Focused attacks somewhat mitigate the risks associated with the Gremlin Boomstick attacks and compensate for their low CB. In the event you find your Bayou Gremlins in melee (a place they definately should not be) then Reckless Abandon and the squeel! trigger can provide some assistance in either dealing DG with the Rusty Weapons they carry (should they survive to use them) or help them survive for another round by getting out of combat. One of the often over looked abilities of the Bayou Gremlins is Deliverance, though Terrifying 11 isn't super great it does give a way around the Harmless defense, and can be used as another mechanic to burn your opponents draw deck. In summation they tend to work best when used in packs, and a Gremlin Gun Line can do a surpising amount of DG (or with bad flips destroy it self). Like the rest of the Gremlin crew cat and mouse games go along way toward getting them the win. The Hog Whisperer is a support model for the Pigs pure and simple. They (along with the Skeeters and So'mer) are the driving force behind the speed and mobility of the Pig Boomerang. Judicius use of Sooey (from this model, So'mer and the Skeeters) and never happen... can move a squadron of Pigs (both spells effect all friendly Pigs within range) half way up the board before their activation allowing stampeded pigcharges deep into the enemy lines with little risk of losing your own models, then return them to safety for another launch next round. The two 0 actions on this model provide decent insuruance against errant Pigcharges killing your own models. Survival of the fittest is a nice extra when you are close enough to dying Gremlins to benefit (though remember you can only use one instance of SotF per Gremlin Death regardless of how many models with the ability are within 6"). Piglets, generally agree with what was stated by Raintar, though will add that Pigcharges are pushes so allow these models to freely leave melee combat. Also if the pigs are flying they will allow you to bypass screening models to get at the heart of the enemy during these pushes. Judicious use of Reckless fast can give piglets a surprising threat range and DG potential (Reckless Fast can be used even when the Pigs are Stampeding). Lastly, models with the Pig characteristic dont have to fear being the target of a stampeding pig, so use them in squadrons of 3 or more. Warpigs, what applies to the Piglets generally applies to their bigger brother. The key difference is the base size, being on a large base they can block LOS to models which may be closer then the ones you want to attack (or friendlies) giving a small bit of control during stampedes. They also have a few situational abilities that are neat, such as the Truffle spell which can move a misplaced freindly Gremlin, or Eat anything which removes all Scrap and Corpse tokens within its range healing the Warpig 2 WD's per counter removed (still some debate on whether models leave these tokens if there are no Graverobbers or Scavengers on the field). Giant Mosquitos, though the characteristic change from Gremlin to Vermin did eleminate an "Easy button" for the Gremlin Crews it also streamlined their role within the crew. Along with Som'er and the Hog Whisperers this model can cast Sooey! which allows the pigs to be boomeranged around the board and greatly enhances the Pigs threat range. As was mentioned by Lalochezia a pair of them can move anywhere on the board and set up your pig squadrons. Parasitic Infection can work miracles against the Resurectionist cannon fodder (on a successful cast you can almost guruantee that troublesome Flesh Construct or Killjoy will go bye bye). Another significant point is that due to the characteristic change from Gremlin to Vermin, Skeeters can now damage other skeeters with Pull my finger attacks (though thankfully the one who casts it wont) so careful placement when attempting the skeeter Stank Cloud is a must. Lastly, though Som'er can bond upto four, two tends to be his best number (at least until they start making more). The above models tend to work best (at their full potential) when used together. Other Masters dont really get much use out them largely due to the increased SS cost per model. With any of these models WP duels are best avoided at all costs. Lastly, with all the above models except Som'er and the Warpig, fear Hamelin, his Bully ability coupled with Growing Influence and his Spells can reek havoc on your plans. Being a gremlin player I thought I'd chime in here. I totally agree with most of this. I would just like to add a few things. 1) The hog whisperer. For me, he goes up field where I don't want to send sommer (for fear of him being squashed) and still allows me to draw cards when those gremlins die. Also, with eight wounds, he can be an alright last resort speed bump before they get to sommer, or treasure counter mule. (although a reactivated warpig usually fetches the treasure counter for him) 2) Pigs and stampede. It is my understanding of the rules as written that the pigs MUST use reckless fast while stampeding, although I never really got a ruling on that. I'll go bump that thread. 3) I completely agree that two mosquitoes is the optimum starting number, but I thought I'd clarify why. Buying all four mosquitoes at the start of the game is a waste. Mosquitoes and gremlins are the same soul stone cost, so the more mosquitoes you have to summon with larvae, the better. The reason being that (so long as you have at least one mosquito) you can sacrifice a gremlin to summon another mosquito. This is superior to just buying a mosquito before the game because the gremlin you lost didn't cost you anymore than the mosquito and it netted you two cards when it died. And maybe you were able to activate it first and get some use out of it. So, now you may be wondering, why have two mosquitoes? Why not just one? The answer to that is souey. You want at least one mosquito that can use one AP to move up field 10" and another AP to cast souey and net all your pigs extra movement (which you get even if you fail this spell). Obviously, a summoned mosquito couldn't accomplish this since it is slow. Thanks for doing all the hard work Omenbringer! Good summary of the gremlin force. And good luck summarizing all of this for the opening post, Massaen. Oh, and you might want to leave out the mosquito infinite movement. I'm sure it's going away. I just thought it was funny that a model with one of the most blatantly broken possibilities in the game was being called garbage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massaen Posted December 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Yeah, thanks! :thsigns05 Should be done in the next 24 hours... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 :whip: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 12 hours, 7 minutes left... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massaen Posted December 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 Updated and done! Any extra input welcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 (edited) ..... Edited March 15, 2011 by Justin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 (edited) Ill add to this for the SPA's and Desolation Engine, Levy has his own thread which I've put my thoughts into already. Just for a note, I use these guys regularly and love them, they are two of my favorite units in the game. They play a bit strangely compared to the other models in the game, but they are nasty. =D Oh by the way, word vomit! :blah: Steam Punk Abominations: Yes these little buggers are a bit of a head scratchier the first time you look at them. But they are only 3 ss each, so right off the bat they are a good cheap unit. Their stat line is nothing amazing and mostly a bit bellow average, but then again they are 3 ss each ;D. They have 1 melee weapon which has a lowish CB but still enough to hit most things in the game, just stear them away from the high Df targets unless your confident you can hit them. Hard to wound 1 gives them some help with surviving, making it so you can live through most weak attacks and generally eating through your enemies deck. Warped gives you the counter type you need at the moment and Caustic Aura can be a fun little addition, I like it because it burns the enemies deck and sometimes it actually goes off! Anomaly is how you keep them safe when moving up field, in my next little blurb on movement, you always want your second ap to be this. Their triggers are nice, Consuming Touch rarely comes into play (since 3 wds often means either full health or dead). Desolate Warpings is great, but these guys are a bit hard pressed to kill anything. Though using them to make the finishing blow is always a good idea. Honestly the most interesting thing about these little guys are Hobbled and Keep Pace and a trick involving this. So hobbled, they can only move once per turn, yeah that kinda sucks for them, but wait! Theres more! Keep pace is how you get them up field, you deploy 4 of them (always want 4 of them if your going to bring them, need to make Big D ;D) in base to base. Because of the base size etc, you can get all of them in b2b with 2 of them: __a _bcd something like that, can't exactly draw it well here. But all of them are in b2b with a and c. So what you do is move a first, drag all the rest with you and you push so b and d are in the front. Now you have b move and take a with him and then d move and make sure d moves in such a way as to place himself and a and b back in b2b with c. You then have c move and drag them all along and after this wonderful 12" of movement, you have 1 ap left, whatever shall you do with it? Concentrated Deformations is what! Summoning the Desolation Engine 6" from c and suddenly you have just sprinted it 18" up the board and it still has an activations. For added fun, have Rusty Alice do Burn out to one of them as they are moving up so that when they form the Desolation Engine, it gets Reactivate. Just make sure not to use up the Reactivate on the SPA you put it on ;D. The way I see this unit is, if you are going to bring them and not just make them, you want to use this movement trick to get a Desolation Engine up field in a hurry. Desolation Engine: What a mean sucker, this thing is a powerhouse of pure utter awesome. So lets take a look at his stat line, a mix of everything, he has high wounds and a good speed with decent casting and horrible defense. His weapon is freaking great! Paired, so you have a positive flip on attack already, and good Cb with a nice damage spread and he has the suite for his triggers. Hard to wound 1 helps keep him alive, honestly I wish it was HTW 2 but ah well, cant have everything ;D. Lost focus makes it so you will always recoop some of your losses with this big guy. The SPA's are summoned to it, so that means withing 6" of it, which lets you say hide them behind a building ;D. These are brand new models to, so they get to activate this turn still! Though with slow, but oh well, heh. Industrial Nightmare is hilarious, if this thing lives to the end of a closing phase after you rocket it up into the enemy line they are going to have some semi tough duels to pull off or take some pain. This can be great for getting some damage on a swarm of piddly units like terror tots or Ronin or spiders. Necrotic Repository Ive never used, I suppose it could be useful for Levy to do if on that same turn your going ot make a major strike at the enemies master, but otherwise, why sacrafice it? Unstable Creation literally defines this things entire existance, but remember, it takes the wd after it finish the action. So you can with your last wd, strike and heal up with consuming touch trigger and cheat death basically. It is a melee expert which just compounds to the danger it posses. Consume gives it the chance to heal up a bit if you have a spare SPA hanging around (which you probably will ). Unnatural Feeding is sorta meh, I wouldn't sac one of my models for a single card, but thats jsut me. Warped ANomaly is how it survives ranged attacks as well, protecting it from guns and spells with the gun symbol. It has the same triggers at the SPA's but with a much nastier stat line to use them. It will need to use Consuming Touch on just about every attack to keep it's wds up and Desolate Warpings when your doing a killing blow. It's one spell, Desolate Suplications is freaking great. I love this spell, and yes he needs to draw an 11 of tombs or higher to pull it off, but thats 2 damage to all within 6" of him, stack that with his Industrial Nightmare and a full turn of eating faces and this guy is a hurricane of damage. So overall this guy is big and a bit unwieldy but his damage potential per turn is single to none but hte master who creates him. He will shread the biggest things in the game and giggle as his very existance kills the piddlies around him. My best advice for using him, use the SPA delivery system I described above. Otherwise he is taking 1 wd every time he moves and that will very very quickly add up. By the time he reaches melee, he will be more then half dead if he ever reaches it. A smart enemy will just run him around, never engaging him if they can help it. The Desolation Engine is ALL offense, its defensive abilities are lacking and it most likely wont live through a round of concentrated attack. So what this means is, you MUST kill your targets and keep yourself safe by killing anyone who can hurt you. I seariously recomend NOT sending this guy at the enemy master right off the bat, they will still have all their SS and will be able to cheat fate and SS up their df duels to dodge you. Instead use it to kill the masters army, whipe out the support units and clusters of dangerous units. Toss him at a block of ranged units and watch him wipe the floor with them. Hurl him into the biggest thing the enemy has and watch him break it over his knee like Bane did to Batman. He is by no means unstoppible, make sure you drill this into your head before you use him. He is ALL offense. He survives through eliminating all threats to him and keeping his wounds as high as he can. Do not let the enemy get free shots on him if you can help it, he's not a tank by any means. Edited December 30, 2009 by karn987 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omadon Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 Updated and done! Any extra input welcome! Paragraphs are your friend. >.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massaen Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 Paragraphs are your friend. >.> Huh? There are breaks... fixed up the mosquito entry and will update the SBA and DE as soon as i get time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paperbag4 Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 There are breaks between the subjects. I believe that what Omadon was referring to is the density of some of the entries. Breaking them down from one paragraph each into a few paragraphs would make them easier to read, as it allows the eyes to remember where they are on the page, as well as putting thoughts together in a fashion that makes a cohesive whole. (I'm not saying your thoughts aren't coherently laid out, I saw the length of the paragraphs and did not re-read them.) Otherwise, I commend you for a fine job in organizing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omadon Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Also - where you've copied and pasted some of the stuff I've said, *twitch*, you've just lumped totally opposing oppinions in the same breath. True, you started this thing, but I'd really prefer if you didn't appoint yourself editor of the lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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