Considerations for Summer Errata

[Ludvig]

@Nukemouse

I understand completely why Wyrd don't want us playing with proxies because from a business point of view the rules are pretty much a way to advertise the actual product that makes them money. I would assume that's why so many mini games give you the rules for free these days. I don't doubt for a second that the designers love designing the rules so don't get me wrong. I just mean that if the rules were the actual product I would assume they would need to be a lot more expensive to cover everyone's wage while desinging them.

The rules can change suddenly, the sculpt remains. The fact that Wyrd pursues balance erratas is very good in my opinion. If your purchase of a model actually included the rules then rebalancing something would be akin to a breach of contract and players should be able to ask for their money back. This philosophy is why I don't pay for models I don't like the look of but find proxies or use other official models and forego the rules of that model.

[Daysleeper]

To limit Kentauroi summoning for Nico, but not for Molly maybe Kentauroi could have something like:

critical mass: if a corpsemarker is sacrificed to summon this model, sacrifice two corpsemarkers in 2 instead or the action immediately fails 

that way Nico needs more ressources, but molly stays untouched

[Fetid Strumpet]

There is an easier way. Just remove the undead trait.

[TeddyBear]

17 minutes ago, Fetid Strumpet said:

There is an easier way. Just remove the undead trait.

But in this way, Levi's players will not be able to hire him again. 👻

[Fetid Strumpet]

So?

[TeddyBear]

4 hours ago, Fetid Strumpet said:

So?

Nothing, only become a problem for who bought kentauroi for levi

[PolishSausage]

or, for those that purchased the model for Levi, remove the ability to summon the model by making it enforcer? Pew Pew

[TeddyBear]

but summonable by molly in some way..?

[Fetid Strumpet]

Remove the undead trait and Nico can’t summon it but Molly can. Add the construct trait and Levi can hire it, if that matters, which I don’t feel it does. 

[Math Mathonwy]

Removing Undead from them doesn't make much sense from a fluff perspective, though. I very much doubt that it will happen.

[Fetid Strumpet]

I doubt any changes will happen, but even so if the mechanics work better then they’ll do it. Their in game reason for why Avatars no longer work the way they did is beyond doggerel. The mechanics and realtites and real world economics dictated the rules change, fluff then had to have “something” to justify it.

It made no thematic sense for Sybelle not to be a belle, but it still happened. And you can justify it in fluff the same way in that creating such a hybrid interferes in some nebulous way with whatever necromantic energy animates it, and that it is mostly created by the same forces that create constructs.

[Daysleeper]

On 5/31/2018 at 1:03 PM, Fetid Strumpet said:

There is an easier way. Just remove the undead trait.

But that would change a lot more than just nico not being able to summon them. They don't leave corpses, they can't be healed/ given fast by nico for example ... and a lot of other effects in the game that target undead wouldn't work anymore. 
So that would be a major change to the model, not just the nico-shouldn't-be-able-to-summon-them problem.

[Fetid Strumpet]

Yes, and as far and I’m concerned those are all features, not bugs.

Most people complain about the Kentauroi. It’s a powerful model that doesn’t need those blanket bonuses to be worthwhile. Taking those away actually then does what the game should do, make you weigh up the pros and cons between models. Taking or summoning a Kentauroi isn’t always the best choice at that point. Which is a good thing.

Additionally I think it’s a good think if they finally create more and more non undead models for Ressers. 

[katadder]

Making kentauroi enforcers and giving them hard to kill would fix them (and still allow Levi to hire as wyrd stopping this would annoy alot of Levi players including me).

Then undertaker being non peons would fix that.

And that's nico fixed

[Fetid Strumpet]

And yet that would annoy all the other resser masters because then Kentauroi would no longer be able to be buffed by the carrion emissary’s carrion conflux, as well as other things other masters do to take advantage of minions. Molly would no longer be able to give them reactivate with her other 0 action. Making them an enforcer changes far more things then just changing some traits. Yes that still changes things but it is more unfair to change things for the other masters in such a way. 

I mean if the biggest thing we want to stop is Nicodem summoning them here’s an idea, just give them an ability:

Nicodem can not summon me: Masters named Nicodem cannot summon this model.

[katadder]

How often do you see the standard emmisary conflux? It's either a master related one or mlh 

[catbat07]

17 hours ago, Fetid Strumpet said:

Nicodem can not summon me: Masters named Nicodem cannot summon this model.

Simple, elegant and effective. It works perfectly.

[Sagrit]

13 hours ago, katadder said:

How often do you see the standard emmisary conflux? It's either a master related one or mlh 

Seriously? Giving "+" to all those Lures when you have couple of Belle's could be pretty crucial on Turn 1 especially nowadays with GG18

[thatlatinspeakingguy]

I haven't seen anything beside generic conflux on Carrion Emissary tbh.

[katadder]

5 hours ago, Sagrit said:

Seriously? Giving "+" to all those Lures when you have couple of Belle's could be pretty crucial on Turn 1 especially nowadays with GG18

as its a nico nerf we are on about he does that anyway doesnt he? also lures really dont need buffs as they pretty much always go off

[Math Mathonwy]

19 hours ago, katadder said:

also lures really dont need buffs as they pretty much always go off

No they don't. Ca 7 vs Wp isn't an autowin. The positive twists add a ton of value and you can also fish for crows. I really suggest you try, e.g., a Molly Belle spam with a generic upgrade Emissary. It makes a huge difference.

[Freman]

Remembering all those positive flips would probably have helped with my last game with Nicodem. Also, I'm less concerned by Pandora now. Charging her with a Rogue Necromancy can work.