Mah Tucket - is there any hope?

[Flippin' Wyrd George]

Hi all, I'm normally an Arcanist player and do fairly well with them on the UK tournament scene but I'm mixing it up and trying some niche masters this year. Wanting to give Mah Tuckett a go. I've had one game with her so far vs summoning Rasputina and managed to scrape a 6-4 win.

Flank deployment/Symbols of Authority

Punish the Weak

Set Up (Snowstorm)

Dig their graves 

Recover Evidence

Public Demonstration

 

I hired this crew and took Punish & Set up on Snowstorm. I got 4 for the strat and 1 on each scheme. Raspy scored 1 for dig, 2 for punish and 1 for symbols.

Leader: Mah Tucket - Cache:(5)
   Lead Lined Apron 2ss 
   Manifest Destiny 1ss 
   Dirty Cheater 1ss 
The Little Lass 4ss (Know the Terrain 0ss)
Trixiebelle 8ss 
   A Gun For a Lady 1ss 
Sammy LaCroix 7ss 
   Pit Traps 1ss 
Francois LaCroix 8ss 
   Stilts 1ss 
   Do Over 1ss 
Gremlin Taxidermist 7ss 
   Dirty Cheater 1ss 
Bayou Gremlin 3ss 
Bayou Gremlin 3ss 

 

Francois threw himself at raspy and took her to 4 wds before dropping to snowstorm. Sammy ran around making piglets whilst denying enemy dig their graves markers, but not doing much else. The bayou gremlins ran down the flank to grab markers and did their job. The taxidermist made piglets and ran schemes. Trixy killed a wendigo for my only punish point before being sacriced to an ice golem. Little lass spaffed about a bit not really doing anything and Mah tried to get in raspys grill (ultimately delivering the final blow on raspy, but not after failing to topdeck hits on a charge, and doing nothing exciting all game except a bit of card cycle)

I think the crew itself was excellent, but in hindsight I would have taken out traps on Little Lass, used her to make more pit traps in key locations, and saved an extra stone in the cache.

 

Now my biggest issue was: what does Mah actually do? Am I missing a trick or is she really as bad as she seems. I can get her to melee 8 but I am crippling my crews resources, I can push models around but is this how I want to use my master? She's quite mobile with get off my land but also very vulnerable with no defensive trigger. At the moment it seems she just cycles cards, hits moderately and is a vassal for pit traps.

The traps were really good, and her card cycle was excellent, but otherwise I'm not sure what she does other than kill one/maybe two models before dying herself. She doesn't seem to bring much to the table. Am I missing any combos? How can I utilise Mah, Sammy & Little Lass a bit more? Interested to hear the Gremlin forum braintrust thoughts. 

 

Ta

[wizuriel]

So imo Mah is probably one of the weakest masters in the game. 

What she can do really well is with her errata upgrade she is fairly mobile for schemes like entourage and can also interact unlike Zipp. She can kind of support her crew better than Zipp with chores (though 90% of the time they are useless outside of rams for +1MI and sometimes unimpeded).

If you want a master that is mobile, good at flanking and will actually hit hard Zipp is just better. 

 

If you want to continue with Mah the only combo I think you're missing is she really likes having a Crier in her crew for even more card cycling.  

Edit: Also I personally out the apron on the Little Lass and run her up. When she inevitable dies doing nothing useful Mah gets the armor for 1SS cheaper. I would put know the terrain on Mah at the start

[Finalscene]

I really like to take the emmissary with mah. It becomes a large melee threat and occasionally can put out paralyze. His mAh upgrade let's him discard a card for an extra chore which means I'm less reliant on initiative and the fact that's it's a discard instead of a cheat like trixiebelle, I can get my chore while also cycling with a crier nearby. Personally I run Mah as a disruption master. Trixie, Mah, little lass, bushwhackers, and emmissary all have ways to mess with positioning; whether you want to get a better spot for your crew, or a bad spot for your opponent. It's also alot of fun to push enemies into the pit traps.

[Dogmantra]

I've had some good results using both her new upgrades (Pit Traps going on the Little Lass). She pushes around a ton for practically no cost, and her push isn't too bad at shoving lower Wp models out of position. I've mostly used her as a quick surgical strike with the start of turn push as a run away tool but I imagine she would work quite nicely as a scheme runner hunter or flanker of some sort. She's no Som'er but then, who is?

[wobbly_goggy]

Oooh Lush! I am a big fan of playing unpopular/weak/'crap' masters, and have a particular fondness for Mah.

The way I way I play her (with, admittedly, limited success - though that could be said of all my masters) is to annoy and pester the enemy, and have the Lass do the same, whilst my crew earn the points.

The first thing that screams out from your crew selection is why on earth you didn't take the First Mate? Negs on Sh when he hasn't activated, he can swallow annoying little gamin and he has a stupidly easy leap. He has won me all the strat points for Symbols pretty much by himself. He is seriously fantastic. 

Although I see the logic in Sammy and Trixi here, I am not sure it was the best way to spend SS. Sammy doesn't fit so well here that I can see. Why not Burt for killing? Or experiment with another poorly thought of mini - Mancha Roja? Killy, massive charge sometimes and Mah can push him into position.
I know I'll get flak for this - Trxi is essential etc, but all of the chores are useful to some extent IMO

Relying on Bayou Gremlins here for Symbols would be a liability - they're too easy to kill and give PTW points. So how were you going to get the symbols? 

With respect (as I know your name and rep if not you in person), I think you picked the wrong crew for the pool. With minis better suited to interacts and/or killing, you would leave Mah free to do her own thing. This could be getting in the enemy's face and denying them PTW points, engaging multiple models so they can't interact/place markers/Symbols. 

Bushwhacker(s) would also have been a good choice for Symbols. Pushing to get closer to them, pushing minis out of position (in some ways they're actually better at combat), niceish shot....

I would also drop the Apron - give it to the Lass for free and then get it free when she dies (which she will). I also tend to take Dirty Cheater so she has some way of regaining wounds. Perhaps that and Pit Traps and Know the Terrain, LLA on the Lass.
The Lass can also be very useful. If you get chores and give here Ml6, she can hit HARD. Or she can force your opponent to use high cards to avoid damage, or suffer decent damage from a crappy peon if you smash her into things first. Cranky would also have been a good choice to defend the symbols in your half.

So what does Mah do? 
Well for me she annoys the opponent and fills in gaps where she's needed. For me she isn't the thrust of the points winning, she's supporting your toys in doing so, and helping deny the enemy. (She was also a great FFM target in 2017.. many points won with her that way  )

[daniello_s]

With Mah you really want to take Ml experts so Burt, Franc, Emissary, Golem, Taxidermist, Roosters, Manja and season it with Survivors.

[Math Mathonwy]

4 hours ago, wobbly_goggy said:

I would also drop the Apron - give it to the Lass for free and then get it free when she dies (which she will). I also tend to take Dirty Cheater so she has some way of regaining wounds. Perhaps that and Pit Traps and Know the Terrain, LLA on the Lass.

No Manifest Destiny??

As for the topic, I think that Mah's strength is in positioning - both herself, her own models and the opponent's models. Her support comes from positioning and from card cycling. The latter doesn't look very flashy but is pretty amazing. I mostly ignore her chores (incidental bonus) and don't think that you need to focus your crew on melee or anything. I mean, nothing wrong about doing so and I do love using The Sow with Mah but I think that focusing on getting the holy grail of +1 Ml from Rams isn't necessarily the best plan. The 4" Melee range is enormous and her mobility let's her put it into an optimal spot which can be really debilitating.

[wobbly_goggy]

1 hour ago, Math Mathonwy said:

No Manifest Destiny??

Shoot,  sorry! Early morning posting!  Of course I do!!!😊

I normally take mah: manifest destiny,  know the terrain, dirty cheater

Lass: pit traps

Pit traps I see as useful bonus like chores (as you mentioned) but not something to Base a crew around.

For that reason I rarely take Trixi  - seems to be focusing too much on something nice to have but not essential. (Like initiative,  but I'll Stine for that anyway)

 

[Clement]

My prefered Mah upgrade set is Manifest Destiny, know the terrain, Dirty Cheater.  Lass gets the apron and normally either is shot to death turn 2 (oh well) or is sacrificed somewhere in 2 or early turn 3 to put the crew into overdrive, hopefully after she roughed something up.

Mah can run a great tag team bouncing around and beating up enemy models or ruining positions better then many.  She's actually *more* mobile then Zipp, but has a janky way of going about it between get off my land and Let Mah Handle This.

The one thing I'm really unsure of as an inclusion is pit traps.  Unless you're doing a marker strategy that involves standing around (Extraction, Guard the Stash, that kind of thing) I have a tough time getting a lot of use out of it.  The markers are relatively easy to just walk around unless your Wk 4 or something.

[wizuriel]

10 minutes ago, Clement said:

  She's actually *more* mobile then Zipp, but has a janky way of going about it between get off my land and Let Mah Handle This.

 

With Wk 5 Mah can cover 15".  Git off my land she can get to 23". If you use her just for moving and also use let Mah handle this she can move 29". That also assumes she pushes her max on 2 pushes and gets unimpeded on chores

 

Zipp base movement with flight gets him 24". He can also with triggers attack models on the way covering as much ground. With dread pirate upgrade he can cover an additional 10" for 34" (probably 35 or so taking into account base sizes and placement). Zipp requires far less resources and can actually do stuff when going all out movement.

[Clement]

4 minutes ago, wizuriel said:

 

With Wk 5 Mah can cover 15".  Git off my land she can get to 23". If you use her just for moving and also use let Mah handle this she can move 29". That also assumes she pushes her max on 2 pushes and gets unimpeded on chores

 

Zipp base movement with flight gets him 24". He can also with triggers attack models on the way covering as much ground. With dread pirate upgrade he can cover an additional 10" for 34" (probably 35 or so taking into account base sizes and placement). Zipp requires far less resources and can actually do stuff when going all out movement.

She can save her push movement for the rough terrain, so the unimpeded on chores isn't really as necessary.  Zipp does have a trigger to take a free walk action to help him not lose ground, but it's not baked in and requires actual hitting.  So I'm not sure how burning Masks and/or soulstones is somehow "less resource intensive" then just declaring "she's over here now".

 

A better way of selling Zipp's mobility is that he straight up flies.  Assuming you have a more or less straight shot, Mah can cover more ground, but Zipp can cover *any* ground.  Pity he can't interact though.

[wizuriel]

8 minutes ago, Clement said:

She can save her push movement for the rough terrain, so the unimpeded on chores isn't really as necessary.  Zipp does have a trigger to take a free walk action to help him not lose ground, but it's not baked in and requires actual hitting.  So I'm not sure how burning Masks and/or soulstones is somehow "less resource intensive" then just declaring "she's over here now".

 

A better way of selling Zipp's mobility is that he straight up flies.  Assuming you have a more or less straight shot, Mah can cover more ground, but Zipp can cover *any* ground.  Pity he can't interact though.

Earl can give him the masks and he can pretty easily hit with up we go. Even so straight up mobility Zipp still wins at 34 inches

[PolishSausage]

Mah needs higher CA value on her push, its the only way to differentiate her from all of our other masters.

Otherwise she is just a weaker version of Zip/Ophelia in the Melee brawling department.

Also all of her standard upgrade need to be re-visited / merged 

[daniello_s]

I think she is OK now although Manifest Destiny should really be an update of her card rather than upgrade.

[Flippin' Wyrd George]

Thank you all for your replies. Lots of interesting points here, have also considered Zipp but I would like to use Mah for now.

I had another game with Mah in Ours last night, this time against Titania. The pool contained Guarded Treasure, Dig Their Graves, Hold up their forces, Take one for the Team and Set Up (or Undercover entourage, my opponent and I crossed wires and I thought we had Set Up and he thought it was Undercover, so pool of 6 schemes!) I used:

Leader: Mah Tucket - Cache:(6)
   Lead Lined Apron 2ss 
   Manifest Destiny 1ss 
   Dirty Cheater 1ss 
The Little Lass 4ss (Pit Traps 0ss)
Trixiebelle 8ss 
   A Gun For a Lady 1ss Dirty Cheater 1ss 
Sammy LaCroix 7ss 
Francois LaCroix 8ss 
   Stilts 1ss 
   Do Over 1ss 
Gremlin Taxidermist 7ss 
Bayou Gremlin 3ss 
Bayou Gremlin 3ss 

 

From my last list I moved dirty cheater to Trixy (which kept her alive past turn 3) and dropped pit traps from Sammy onto Little Lass which saved me a stone in my cache.

I scored 3 from Ours using Mah to hold an opposing quarter Turns 3 & 4, also scoring Hold Up their forces for two points in the process, and I took Take One for the Team on the Taxidermist for 2 points (killed by a Waldgeist in turn 4).

My opponent took an unexpected Undercover Entourage on Titania for 3 points, scored 2 from Ours, and 2 from Dig their Graves. We called the game 7-7 as we were unsure what the actual scheme pool was so we allowed both set-up and Undercover in the pool.

The standout points were that using Sammy to turn my opponents important scheme markers into stuffed piglets has been HUGE. She has been close to MVP in both games. She goes under the radar a lot with her AP but being able to shut down your opponents schemes (in this instance, Dig their graves) whilst also engaging models with irritating piglets is great. I find the taxidermist good for this too as it allows Mah to keep up on activations during the game. Pit Traps were once again outstanding. Together with the horror duels from Sammy, my opponent was regularly having to use two cards from his hand to fully activate a model next the pit traps. Trixy was very useful as a ranged threat and didn't gremlin lure once. Francois traded himself for the Mysterious Emissary which shut down the summoning mechanic of the Titania crew. The Little Lass overextended turn was and was taken off before she could active and the Bayou Gremlins did sweet naff all, hiding from dig their graves points. One interesting point from the game is that every turn Titania managed to put the condition on Mah that Mah may only attack Titania unless she discards two cards. This shut down Mah for the entire game as she didn't want to waste her AP hitting a very tanky, healy Titania, so instead ran Pit Traps and tried to survive all game. Perhaps some condition removal would be useful in the future.

I'm genuinely thinking Mah might be good, though possibly its the gremlin crew around her that is doing the job... I am very happy with the changed list and can see this being ran in most pools.

[Math Mathonwy]

I don't think that Mah is bad. I think that she is pretty good, in fact. With the new Upgrades her only problems are being so realiant on a ton of Upgrades and Zipp doing much of what she does but better.

But she can certainly put up a good fight and win against anyone. And she's a lot of fun.

[daniello_s]

4 minutes ago, Math Mathonwy said:

I don't think that Mah is bad. I think that she is pretty good, in fact. With the new Upgrades her only problems are being so realiant on a ton of Upgrades and Zipp doing much of what she does but better.

But she can certainly put up a good fight and win against anyone. And she's a lot of fun.

Agreed. I think she is not as good as Zipp but way better than Ophelia at the moment.

[Platov]

Oh, come on. Mah is niether weakest, nor even weak master. She's tricky, you just have to master her, but Mah, imo, is one of the strongest Gremlin masters. I loved her before book 5(No one EVER expected to see Mah on the table, and no one really knows how to counter her), and after book 5 she became amazing master.

First - Mah is not Lady J. Don't attack with her if you are not sure you can kill the target. With her mobility she can deal with enemy schemerunners easily. Also, she is good at hit-and-run, if you activate her late so, if you activate her last, and then win initiative - you can make 4 charges in a row, and then run away to safety.

Second - mobility. Mah is not just mobile herself. She also helps her crew ALOT. So, using heavy hitters with limited mobility is always good option. Mancha is just perfect for that.

Third - Trixie is not mandatory. If you need chores - just take emissary, he is good with Mah(like, really good. And he can paralize models for Mancha insta gib).

Mah likes meele crews, she can move them, she can buff them. So, huge ml beaters are always an option. Mancha(!!!), Burt(!!), Golem, Emissary. Franc is optional, tho, too long to explain why. Crier are good for card draw. As for minions - wrastlers(!!) are really good, with a little push from Mah, and a little set up they can hit 2 times with Ml 8, and 4(!!!) damage flips from a single charge. Survivers are good, too. They can shoot with Ml stat, and ok damage for 4SS model.

Also, forget about Lass. Cranky is just better.

Mah is a good master. Her problem is her crew. Bushwackers are just not good enough, and you don't really need Trixie and Lass, making her box a little bit worthless.

Summarizing, I played with Mah a lot. And lately i had more than good win rate. Like, 7 wins for 10 games with her. And i feel, i can do better.

As for crew, i use this as a template:

50 SS Gremlins Crew
Mah Tucket + 4 Pool
- Manifest Destiny (1)
- Know The Terrain (1)
- Out For Blood (2)
Mancha Roja (9)
- Dirty Cheater (1)
Lucky Emissary (10)
- Conflux of Bushwhacking (0)
Burt Jebsen (8)
- Dirty Cheater (1)
Gremlin Crier (7)
Wrastler (5)
Wrastler (5)

 

If you need card draw - you swap wrastler for cranky. If you need initiative - emissary for trixie, and so on.