Meliondor Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 We are playing a lot of small games at the moment in our playgroup for Malifaux. No idea why (I prefer 50 points)...but well, who cares. If it helps other players to learn the mechanics of the game, then I am in of course. So what are our best beatsticks? I am looking for models, that can take some hits and smash stuff on their own. For Henchman I think Frank, Phiona and the Judge should be our best beatstick choices? For Enforcers Easily the Peacekeeper. Now that the Rider is 2 points cheaper, he might be an option, too? For the non-unique ones: Executioner seem great not with 15" Threatrange. Witchling Thralls also seem interesting...much harder to kill, also high damage and 6" push and then the charge also gives a nice build in threat range... What are your prefered beat sticks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thstringer Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 Thralls, monster hunters, executioner (especially in small games) , frank and phi. Ryle. Judge always disappoints me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icebreaker Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 Hopkins is a really beast) You can easily deal 15+ damage from shooting if take debt and found a burning enemy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 Judge is fun with another beater so you can combat effectiveness them into taking four more attacks. Granted that it happens under perfect conditions once in a blue moon but it is glorious when it does! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icebreaker Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 as for me Judge is not a hitter at all, he hits not so good as I want, but he is pretty resilient especially after errata when I can give him LLC and he will be cost the same 9cc. I think he will returns to my crews when I would need a model to soak up some damage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adran Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 52 minutes ago, Ludvig said: Judge is fun with another beater so you can combat effectiveness them into taking four more attacks. Granted that it happens under perfect conditions once in a blue moon but it is glorious when it does! Judge standing near Jury with Combat effectiveness and Debt is possible to get 8 attacks from him . Make him fast and its possible for 12 attacks. (jury isn't essential but makes the whole thing less SS to get the mask triggers) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 You'd need a pretty big hand to discard four cards and still have cards to hit with. The Tn on combat effectiveness isn't trivial to beat either. Whoever pulls this off will be crowbed the king/queen of janks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vorschlag Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Ludvig said: Whoever pulls this off will be crowbed the king/queen of janks! I thought that was just anyone who plays Sandeep? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Vorschlag said: I thought that was just anyone who plays Sandeep? I think you are confusing janks with filth... Sandeep should be shot with a soulstone bullet! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thstringer Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 5 hours ago, Ludvig said: Judge is fun with another beater so you can combat effectiveness them into taking four more attacks. Granted that it happens under perfect conditions once in a blue moon but it is glorious when it does! I hate combat effectiveness with a passion. "Here, spend an 11 point (now 10 unless you give him LLC or debt too) model activation to make another model attack instead. Oh by the way, it probably is also going to cost a card from your hand. We made this your toughest henchman, so why don't we give him an upgrade that works best if he isn't getting into it". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icebreaker Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, 4thstringer said: We made this your toughest henchman, so why don't we give him an upgrade that works best if he isn't getting into it You can cast combat effectiveness on Judge ))) You still need a lot of cards/tomes/masks/SS and a miracle to cast/hit everything successfully, however Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted January 10, 2018 Report Share Posted January 10, 2018 15 minutes ago, 4thstringer said: I hate combat effectiveness with a passion. "Here, spend an 11 point (now 10 unless you give him LLC or debt too) model activation to make another model attack instead. Oh by the way, it probably is also going to cost a card from your hand. We made this your toughest henchman, so why don't we give him an upgrade that works best if he isn't getting into it". It would have been better (situationally) to have it built in so Judge was 10 and always had it on his card. That way your most expensive model would be really hard to kill and also safe for games with murder protege. I have found it efficient on stuff like executioners and thralls who heal from attacks/kills. It is silly that it's often most effectively used on himself though but sometimes ap transfer is a really powerful tool and getting two 9-11ss ap from one ap on a 10ss model isn't bad. Now that McMourning can bring pigs with eath your fill this should get REALLY janky and silly. Looking this up I just realised we've had access to Gracie all along... Why have I not done this already?! Hannah with Loco's buff might also be pretty happy about a couple of more blasting ml attacks and she helps by bringing more cards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adran Posted January 11, 2018 Report Share Posted January 11, 2018 well the whole thing needs 3 mid level tomes, 3 other mid level cards ( I think its a 7, but can't remember off the top of my head) for the combat effectiveness, then 6 successful opposed duels with the mask (which Jury allows you to in effect use a low card to replace a stone to get it). Plus 6 other duels which only let you do damage, so we really don't care about... so 9 suits, 6 of which can be switched for a card discard, 6 simple duels and 6 opposed duels you have to win. Easy 12 hours ago, 4thstringer said: I hate combat effectiveness with a passion. "Here, spend an 11 point (now 10 unless you give him LLC or debt too) model activation to make another model attack instead. Oh by the way, it probably is also going to cost a card from your hand. We made this your toughest henchman, so why don't we give him an upgrade that works best if he isn't getting into it". Sounds a little like any master with obey (or Lucius). But I understand the objection 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meliondor Posted January 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2018 Let's get not into details why Judges Upgrade feels wrong :-). What I am unsure about: What should we take, if we just want a strong beatstick without Synergie? Just as "second" team, while your master does his thing? I am really unsure what is better: Thralls, Exceturioner, one of the henchmen... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinalForm Posted January 11, 2018 Report Share Posted January 11, 2018 I have my idea: Top guild beater for his points is Bishop imo. With debt he can beat the living crap out of anybody. min 4 dmg(or even 5 in some situations) or min 3 with ignor of most def abilities is VERY, Very strong. He is pretty tough and well-rounded, can paralize, can flurry and with fast from any source he becomes just a BEAST. Outside of Bishop hype- i like executioners, but they have 0ss upgrade and can't realy pick debt or any other goodies. Thrall is a top pick for 9 points, but only 2 actions and no upgrades. Fast Sam with debt, bullet and while within 12 AND shooting burning target IS the top damage dealer, but come on. This is nearly impossible to do without masters help. But this is still 4 times 5min damage. Peacekeeper with debt is top dd, but he is VERY hungry for ss. I think rider is ok now, but not even close to say executioner. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adran Posted January 11, 2018 Report Share Posted January 11, 2018 8 minutes ago, Meliondor said: Let's get not into details why Judges Upgrade feels wrong :-). What I am unsure about: What should we take, if we just want a strong beatstick without Synergie? Just as "second" team, while your master does his thing? I am really unsure what is better: Thralls, Exceturioner, one of the henchmen... The real answer is it depends on what you are actually trying to do. There are a lot of models that can deal a lot of damage. Some are best up close, some are best at range, and some work in both. Some are pretty durable, others die fairly quickly (Sammual probably does the most damage both close up and at range with only a little help (make sure the target is on fire), but he isn't good at taking a hit). Frank is great up close, ok at range, but his best defence relies on him being engaged. Ryle is better to take out several smaller targets than 1 large target, at least at range anyway. Judge is probably looking at at least some trigger action to make his attacks comparable. Sidir is a strange case of being better at range, but his defence tricks work best up close. Phiona is only close range. Pale rider is very tanky, but possibly lower damage. It does come with the scheme dropping (0) action (turn 2+) and mobility which might be important to win, but don't help with Beatyness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted January 11, 2018 Report Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Meliondor said: Let's get not into details why Judges Upgrade feels wrong :-). What I am unsure about: What should we take, if we just want a strong beatstick without Synergie? Just as "second" team, while your master does his thing? I am really unsure what is better: Thralls, Exceturioner, one of the henchmen... It depends greatly on the master. McCabe and Lucius should prefer a thrall. In a game where you want henchmen to do kills for that scheme you would rather have one of the henchmen but in collect the bounty where henchmen are a huge liability you of course want as low a station as possible. Some factions may influence what you feel will work best as well, Yasinori can kill most models without blinking but really doesn't enjoy hard to wound in combination with armour (so Judge + coat or Peacekeeper seem like good choices). McMourning would generally prefer thralls because he can do his push and drop a marker to make them take a free attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinalForm Posted January 12, 2018 Report Share Posted January 12, 2018 22 hours ago, Ludvig said: McMourning would generally prefer thralls because he can do his push and drop a marker to make them take a free attack. I would rather say MM will prefer Cerberus or Rogue necromancy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted January 12, 2018 Report Share Posted January 12, 2018 58 minutes ago, FinalForm said: I would rather say MM will prefer Cerberus or Rogue necromancy. They're not guild models. I think I would go for one of those beasts and a thrall. The others have great damage output but don't heal or get free attacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tris Posted January 15, 2018 Report Share Posted January 15, 2018 On 10.1.2018 at 5:04 PM, icebreaker said: as for me Judge is not a hitter at all, he hits not so good as I want, but he is pretty resilient especially after errata when I can give him LLC and he will be cost the same 9cc. I think he will returns to my crews when I would need a model to soak up some damage. I never would´ve thought that the day would come where I`m trying to defend him, but the Judge has a better damage profile than Francisco, just saying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icebreaker Posted January 15, 2018 Report Share Posted January 15, 2018 a bit, MI 7 and flurry compensate it 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antipodean Posted January 24, 2018 Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 The executioner. The threat range while holding onto the upgrade is great, especially as you can hide behind terrain midfield, pop around a corner and still charge. I usually don't have too many uses for crows either so the execute trigger is golden towards the end of the round when your opponents had is looking light. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchrisobrien Posted January 24, 2018 Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 I like the executioner a lot, but he always dies so fast in my games. Most of the time I used him was before his Ready to Work upgrade and Nellie was a thing. The rider is definitely not a beat stick. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie Posted January 25, 2018 Report Share Posted January 25, 2018 10 hours ago, jchrisobrien said: The rider is definitely not a beat stick. He is a beatstick in the rare case of Rider McCabe! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antipodean Posted January 25, 2018 Report Share Posted January 25, 2018 Executioner is a beatstick, but certainly not a tank. Unless you can bully little units for healing you need to get value from his killing or threat of killing to make the most of him. I'm not sure I would have run him prior to ready to work though, as I can see him just getting killed before achieving anything. Can recommend giving him another go now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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