Lucius - advice for tournament

[Figgydor]

Hi guys.

After a few months of McCabe-ism, I finally finished painting the Lucius box and decided to play him in a tournament this weekend. I played two games with the tournament schemes this week to test-run him and he was really fun. I put together a list that seems ok, but am open to suggestions and tips. I listened to the Schemes & Stones podcast, but most of the models mentioned as awesome are not released yet, or always out of stock (i.e. The Jury, Monster Hunters).

So, my list was:

• Lucius with Deep Pockets, Surprisingly Loyal and Legalese
• The Scribe
• Captain Dashel with Arrest Him
• Executioner with Ready to Work
• Witchling Thrall
• Guild Lawyer
• Guild Austringer
• Terracotta Warrior

I noticed that, compared to McCabe-like lists, this one lacks speed (I got used to dogs running around and mounted guards and such). The S&S podcast list consists of Lucius, The Scribe, The Jury, 2 Witchling Thralls and flexible spots including 2 austringers, guild investigators, guardian, thallarian queller, doppelganger. Is it a good idea to try and mirror it to some extent (like 2 thralls and 2 austringers) or try and put in a few dogs or a hunter? 

The schemes for the tournament are:

Round 1. (50 SS game) Guard the Stash Standard deployment

accusation, claim jump, frame for murder, recover evidence, last stand

Round 2. (50 SS game) Reckoning Corner deployment

accusation, dig their graves, search the ruins, hunting party, claim jump

Round 3. (50 SS game) Squatter's Rights Flank deployment

dig their graves, leave your mark, set up, inspection, claim jump.

 

any tips appreciated

[4thstringer]

I have two immediate thoughts.  1. The lawyer almost never pays off for me. and 2. What is your plan for Squatters?

[Figgydor]

39 minutes ago, 4thstringer said:

1. The lawyer almost never pays off for me

I might have been lucky with him being more or less useful, but I get 6 stones might be better spent elsewhere.

47 minutes ago, 4thstringer said:

2. What is your plan for Squatters?

no plan yet trying to figure out whether put together something fast and agile, or a few tanks and hold my ground

[4thstringer]

Ok, one thing I have learned from my limited tournament experience, is to play squatters you need a specific plan for squatters.    Even if you can hold your ground, so many lists not can get several squat markers down turn 1.  If you get to far behind early, you often cannot make that up, so it is like spotting your opponent 4 pts.   EDIT:  Don't listen to me. I'm a moron, see below.

[MCOLL81]

All that Dig and no Phiona? 

Hounds and Mounted Guard are both minions and both Guardsman. You can definitely run them with Lucius. I never got around to assembling my Mounted Guard, but would often run 3 hounds for activation in Lucius crews.

Look to Queeg! A Guardsman and can carry Promises for more . Also adds mobility and can whip the hounds to drop schemes.

[Ludvig]

Are you sure you aren't confusing squatter's rights with stake a claim Stringer? 

I find Lucius is a beast in squatter's rights. I WANT my opponent to flip two markers because then I know which two markers to flip back to be mine in the very last activation turn two using Lucius' interact aura and if needed doing the push + interact to get onto the markers. That means they've they've wasted their ap and I score.

Agreed on not liking lawyers. I think Lucius really wants at least one thrall to put some pressure on. In dig their graves I would say thralls are about the best beasters available because of the scheme marker interaction. If hunting party is in the pool there is an obvious advantage to taking beaters that actually score hunting party.

[Ludvig]

4 minutes ago, MCOLL81 said:

All that Dig and no Phiona? 

You don't need Phiona with thralls in a Lucius list. Lucius just makes something interact or does his sniper to trigger both their free attacks against the model you dropped the marker near. 

[MCOLL81]

2 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

You don't need Phiona with thralls in a Lucius list. Lucius just makes something interact or does his sniper to trigger both their free attacks against the model you dropped the marker near. 

Sure I don't NEED her, but she does work well with them.

Commanding something to Interact probably didn't damage the enemy. Phiona damages and then drops and then Thrall attacks.

There can be cases where we'd not want Phiona to attack first (without a marker already down) since it's possible she could "accidentally" kill the target before the marker gets placed... not that that's ever happened 

[4thstringer]

13 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

Are you sure you aren't confusing squatter's rights with stake a claim Stringer? 

I find Lucius is a beast in squatter's rights. I WANT my opponent to flip two markers because then I know which two markers to flip back to be mine in the very last activation turn two using Lucius' interact aura and if needed doing the push + interact to get onto the markers. That means they've they've wasted their ap and I score.

Agreed on not liking lawyers. I think Lucius really wants at least one thrall to put some pressure on. In dig their graves I would say thralls are about the best beasters available because of the scheme marker interaction. If hunting party is in the pool there is an obvious advantage to taking beaters that actually score hunting party.

You are absolutely right.

[Ludvig]

@MCOLL81 She is solid but I don' own her and the expensive models start adding up really fast in a list. Given the synergies Lucius has with minions I think a second thrall might be better for him if you are picking between those. In a toploaded list I'm guessing she would be a good third beater.

[Figgydor]

1 hour ago, MCOLL81 said:

All that Dig and no Phiona? 

nope, no Nellie box, so no Phiona for me.

1 hour ago, Ludvig said:

I find Lucius is a beast in squatter's rights. I WANT my opponent to flip two markers because then I know which two markers to flip back to be mine in the very last activation turn two using Lucius' interact aura and if needed doing the push + interact to get onto the markers. That means they've they've wasted their ap and I score.

this is what I love about Lucius so far. that interact aura is powerful stuff.

 

1 hour ago, Ludvig said:

Agreed on not liking lawyers. I think Lucius really wants at least one thrall to put some pressure on. In dig their graves I would say thralls are about the best beasters available because of the scheme marker interaction. If hunting party is in the pool there is an obvious advantage to taking beaters that actually score hunting party.

thrall is definitely making my lists, I'm just contemplating whether to take a second one   what thrall scheme marker interaction do you mean? i know about the one the executioner has.

[Figgydor]

oh, also... since I got all of you here...  I'm still learning Lucius' tricks. does his Commanding Presence technically mean he can walk three times and target the same model three times? I know Issue Command says you can't, but a thrall taking three actions outside of his activation...

[Ludvig]

3 minutes ago, Figgydor said:

oh, also... since I got all of you here...  I'm still learning Lucius' tricks. does his Commanding Presence technically mean he can walk three times and target the same model three times? I know Issue Command says you can't, but a thrall taking three actions outside of his activation...

AS soon as you pass a horror duel you are immune to all horror from the same model for the rest of the turn so you can only do it once because then the model can't be affected by horror (not even thralls who auto pass). That also means you can't use the ability on a guardian because the guardian is immune so it never takes the duel and therefore never succeeds on it.

 

Thralls and scehem markers: They have a front of card ability that says they get to take an attack whenever another model places a scheme marker near them. It could be a friend or enemy and both can do it off the same scheme marker if they're both near it. Once per thrall per turn though.

[MCOLL81]

1 minute ago, Figgydor said:

oh, also... since I got all of you here...  I'm still learning Lucius' tricks. does his Commanding Presence technically mean he can walk three times and target the same model three times? I know Issue Command says you can't, but a thrall taking three actions outside of his activation...

No.

Once the target passes the Horror Duel, they are immune to Horror Duels from that source for the turn. If immune to Horror Duels, you cannot pass a Horror Duel.

[Figgydor]

right, my bad. forgot about that and got carried away there for a bit.

[MCOLL81]

 It's like there's a Mimic in the room 

[Ludvig]

Oh, btw! It doesn't say he needs to target another model so he can scare himself into taking an extra ap. Very good if you are trying to get somewhere far, especially if you can save the walk to be your last action in his activation.

[Figgydor]

nice! sounds like his style

I'll try and come up with a list with doggies and a mounted guard maybe and see how far it gets me. I've been thinking about Queeg, as was suggested above. i like his interact aura, which could be nice combined with lucius'

[MCOLL81]

4 minutes ago, Figgydor said:

but a thrall taking three actions outside of his activation...

Of course you can still get a Thrall to make three attacks on Lucius' activation...

1. Commanding Presence
2. Issue Command
3. Drop a scheme

[Ludvig]

If Lucius and his totem can apply Red tape to the main beater(s) thralls also go up in survivability a lot. The same is true for the mimic enforcer trio Graves, Tannen, Doppleganger. The positives to their attacks are also nice. Lucius best use of ap is definitely thralls currently.

[Figgydor]

2 minutes ago, MCOLL81 said:

Drop a scheme

nice! overlooked the possibilities of that one.

[MCOLL81]

Just now, Figgydor said:

nice! overlooked the possibilities of that one.

Now go look at 'What Lackeys Are For"

[Figgydor]

2 minutes ago, MCOLL81 said:

Now go look at 'What Lackeys Are For"

does that mean you do the switch and the thrall attacks because a marker was placed?  

[MCOLL81]

1 minute ago, Figgydor said:

does that mean you do the switch and the thrall attacks because a marker was placed?  

Marker must have been placed within Thrall Aura (when placing marker; not after movement). If memory serves, Aura is 4".

Lucius places marker. (Thrall within 4" of marker queues attack until after current action, WLAF, is completed) Lucius places. Target places. Thrall makes attack.

[Ludvig]

6 minutes ago, Figgydor said:

does that mean you do the switch and the thrall attacks because a marker was placed?  

Needs to be close when you actually drop but Lucius could be engaged with something, drop the marker within 4" of the thrall and then swap places so the thrall has reach after the action when the ability goes off.