induction

[geert]

i was playing a new opponent today and he brought up an interesting point of view....

sebastian 's  induction states: enemy models within 6' aura' that suffer damage from the poison condition suffer an aditionel 2 damage  from the poison condition.

so if a model was able to stone for  damage prevention , and he flips a weak card, that would be enough to prevent the first poison damage and therefore the model would not suffer the  aditionel  2 poison damage ...

 

is this correct?

 

Kind regards

[Ludvig]

No, the aura makes poison deal 3, it doesn't say it's after you have suffered damage so it is as soon as you auffer any poison it is turned into three instead of thr customary one point of damage. After determining poison deals 3 damage you get to reduce from that.

[Joachim]

After reading the wording again I agree that they do not use the wording after.

I mentioned this because I play Titania and she can easily reduce damage to 0 and therefore prevent 'after damaging' triggers. But the same wording is not used here so I overlooked that.

[Gloomy]

This has come up many times before. I wish Wyrd would just include it on the FAQ and put it to bed. 

But yes @Ludvig is right in my opinion its a block of 3 damage as opposed to to 1 and then 2. So if you prevent 1 you would still take 2. But because its a single damage block it wouldn't bypass Hard to kill

Its the use of the word 'additional' that makes it confusing

 

[Freman]

Also when you use a Nurse to put a model on negative flips with +2 armour, that block of 3 drops down to 1.

[Nikodemus]

4 minutes ago, Freman said:

Also when you use a Nurse to put a model on negative flips with +2 armour, that block of 3 drops down to 1.

How so? Poison damage can't be reduced.

[Freman]

Are you sure about that? The normal 1 point of damage can't be reduced since generally 1 damage is the minimum you can take, but we've played it that armour affects damage from poison and burning just like any other source. 

[Nikodemus]

Quote

During the Upkeep Step, any model with the Poison Condition suffers 1 damage that may not be reduced or negated.

Page 62 SRB. There's an FAQ that says as much about induction bonus damage, but I think it's one of those unnecessary FAQ's so direct rulebook quote is all you're getting.

Burning, as you've correctly played, has no such "may not be reduced" clause to it in the rulebook.

[Freman]

Darn. I'd actually have killed McTavish that time.

Next time McTavish. Next time.

[Mr Janje]

I've gotta disagree with you guys here


If you suffer damage from poison you suffer an aditional 2

Therefore, you prevent the first point of damage from poison and you don't suffer ANY damage.
I agree its a block of three so it doesn't bypass HTK, but if you prevent 1 you don't suffer any

[solkan]

1 hour ago, Mr Janje said:

I've gotta disagree with you guys here


If you suffer damage from poison you suffer an aditional 2

Therefore, you prevent the first point of damage from poison and you don't suffer ANY damage.
I agree its a block of three so it doesn't bypass HTK, but if you prevent 1 you don't suffer any

So your premise is that the amount of damage you take changes after you have the opportunity to prevent it?

That's horribly misguided, because damage prevention happens after you've determined how much damage you'll suffer.

In other words, you cannot suffer 3 damage after determining you're going to suffer 1 damage from poison.

[mo11usq]

@Aaron please can this be faq'd for good?

[Mr Janje]

I'm of the theory that you resolve conditions and then check for abilities


So you'd take your one poison (or not if you stone) then you take an additional 2 damage if you took that initial one making it a block of 3

[Ludvig]

43 minutes ago, Mr Janje said:

I'm of the theory that you resolve conditions and then check for abilities


So you'd take your one poison (or not if you stone) then you take an additional 2 damage if you took that initial one making it a block of 3

Abilities are explicitly stated to happen immediately when their timing is fulfilled. Triggers and abilities hve timing in regards to each other but conditions have purposefully been left out of that timing chart so there is no support for conditions having a resolution before abilities kixk in while there is an explicit statement that abilities are instant.

This is also not an "after" timing so you don't wait until after giving a chance to stone. It states that you suffer three points of damage from poison if you suffer poison near Sebastian.

[geert]

thx all