wizuriel Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 So FFM is in the pool and your opponent is being super aggressive with super killy model that you just can't ignore, but are pretty sure that is the FFM target. So how does Guild deal with this scenario without giving away 2-3 VP. I know Guild has a lot of really nice killing enforcers / minions that can deny 1 point and still let you get the model off the table, but what are the other options? Some I thought of are 1) Use Deathmarshalls. A pinebox model is still off the table and your opponent gets 0 points for being super aggressive 2) McMourning and crew with induction and cataclysm can try and kill the model with poison, but that might take awhile 3) Sam with Witchhunt could load it up with burning, but again might be slow and requires the model to get close to terrain (would probably work better in a Lucius crew with Doppleganger to also copy Witchhunt). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanzerHarris Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 Death Marshalls are your friend. Granted, locally Frame for Murder is known as the Panzer Handicap because I nearly always give away points, but boxing a model and running the Death Marshall away is an entirely viable tactic. One of my favourite games involved me doing this to a Langston - Death Marshall put him in a box and ran away, forcing Ramos to try and hunt him down. Last turn possible, the Death Marshall doesn't quite get out of range and Ramos kills him. I reveal Frame for Murder on the Death Marshall for 3VPs and my opponent was... unimpressed. Especially as Langston now didn't have enough time to get back in the fight. Equally good denial is using the Emissary and a well-placed Scheme Marker to dump the Frame model way out of position. Or, if you think you can get 3 points for your equivalent scheme, just kill it with an Enforcer, Minion or Peon to only concede 2. That puts you 1 up and personally I'm happy with that these days. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1979 Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 Nelly and the reporters can give the FFM target some conditions that deal damage when the model activates. Excellent for denying FFM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam Warrior Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 On the reverse side, what do you like to put down as your FFM patsy? Again from my limited experience I'm quite keen on a Death Marshal. Nobody likes to see the pine box making a beeline for their master/hench. You can afford a couple to make it less obvious who to stop if they have a delaying plan. And as a last gasp they'll drop a scheme marker for you when they go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1979 Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 with Mcabe I usually take a hound with a lightsaber , always funny. With reactivate from Mcabe and fast they can be in the deployment zone turn 1 Franc is always a good option as any opponent wants to remove him asap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tris Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 Nellie is my go to if FFM is in the pool, I guess McMourning works fine too, and Lawyers could see play there - the burying shenanigans are also quite nice, but if the FFM target is for example a stubborn Yasunori you`ll give up 2 vp more often than you would like to as most (if not all) of these conditions and bury mechanics work against willpower... And of course, the rest of our killy masters struggle a lot with that scheme, but I guess it can`t be helped^^ Oh, and @AK1979 in my experience it`s a bad idea to put frame on a low wound count model with no defensive tech or a model with htk, both types are easily killed by conditions and the like Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizuriel Posted March 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 45 minutes ago, Tris said: Nellie is my go to if FFM is in the pool Just curious but why Nellie? I'm almost wondering if Newucious might be a good choice if FFM is in the pool. He can get work done without needing to kill models, and issue command with focus can help the deathmarshal deal with stubborn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tris Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 Because she (and her crew) get different damaging conditions quite reliably on the opponents models - ca7 vs wp, activate and get 2 damage is great And because she`s just not forced to kill models to work efficiently, unlike Lady J, Perdita, Sonnia, even McCabe likes to get in the middle of things most of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 Lucius. He can give ap to tricky minions and put the condition on them so they are at double negatives, except for A&D... Hate that thing. McMourning with poison also does well for me, you only need the very last hp to tick from poison and both he and Sebastian have automatic infect triggers so the doctor himself can easily cause a lot of damage and end up with a model at low wounds that takes 3 damage on activation and 3 more at turns end, doesn't take long at all. You also have nurses if you want high poison to expunge for exact damage before hitting with McMourning and applying the last point of poison that will kill them. They also apply paralyze and stuff if needed. Haven't used the reporters yet but they should be nice. I'd also echo the sentiment that it's sometimes worth it to just kill the model with a non-henchman if it's really going to ruin your day. People sometimes fake it to br able to be aggressive with a nasty model. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1979 Posted March 29, 2017 Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 In a game some time ago (McAbe versus Lilith ) I mislead my opponent into believing I put FFM on the reactivated dog with lightsaber. Instead I had put it on an empty dog and lured Lilith to make her teleport to the dog and let her kill it. 3vp for me Good times 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trikk Posted March 29, 2017 Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 I just pick Sonnia and go 10:3. In a lot of games the set up required to deny the 2 VPs is not worth the effort and you can just go all in, crush your opponent and punish him for taking that stupid scheme 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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