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Advice for lucius 35ss list


sakurazuka38

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Hello guild fellows,

 

I haven't play malifaux for too long and since there is a beginner oriented tournament next month it's time to dive back!

I always loved lucius but didn't play him for a while (few time to play, too many masters...you know the problem ^^).

With the new profiles with ripples of fate and shifting loyalties and the erratas and i'm a bit lost.

What would be the core of a lucius crew (especially in 35ss).

For the moment i think i will go for lucius, scribe (or malifaux child ?) and maybe the guardian.

Which bruiser can i take : Withcling Thrall ? Mr Grave ? Someonelse ?

And schemers : guild hound ? Changelings ?

Multipurpose role : dopellganger, guild sergeant (for the buff and the scheme marker trick), guild austringer ?

 

Thank you for your advices!

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I can only share my plans:
Mimics:
- Mr. Graves
- 2x Changeling
(- The Scribe)
Guild Minions:
- Death Marshal
- Witchling Thrall
- Austringer
While this will certainly lead you over 35 I think Mr. Graves and 2+ Changelings are a very solid defensive / scheme core. Added to that can be pretty much everything you fancy.
Lucius is rewarded more now upfront as ever, which is why I like Graves a lot and also do not mind the Death Marshal and Witchling Thrall.

 

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Thank you!

 

For the changeling i see that a lot of people love them but on paper (i never played them) i don't understand what's the point with them :

- for attacking...it's not so easy to hit with they built-in 4.

- for scheming : the sprint-like (0) action has two big downsides : it need an anchor and a 7+ card.

 

I'm probably wrong (had the same feeling with the lawyer..meh on paper but gold in play)!

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3 minutes ago, sakurazuka38 said:

Thank you!

 

For the changeling i see that a lot of people love them but on paper (i never played them) i don't understand what's the point with them :

- for attacking...it's not so easy to hit with they built-in 4.

- for scheming : the sprint-like (0) action has two big downsides : it need an anchor and a 7+ card.

 

I'm probably wrong (had the same feeling with the lawyer..meh on paper but gold in play)!

Lawyers are my meh in play choice.   I use them occasionally but I feel like we have much better options at 6 (wardens,  pathfinder,  austringer).   

I love guardians and thralls with lucius.   And terra cotta warriors.   Thralls with lucius and judge (with upgrade) can lead to thralls which heal like crazy. 

Other fun models with lucius include hunters,  witchling stalkers,  orderlies, death marshals and mounted guard. 

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1 hour ago, sakurazuka38 said:

Thank you!

 

For the changeling i see that a lot of people love them but on paper (i never played them) i don't understand what's the point with them :

- for attacking...it's not so easy to hit with they built-in 4.

- for scheming : the sprint-like (0) action has two big downsides : it need an anchor and a 7+ card.

 

I'm probably wrong (had the same feeling with the lawyer..meh on paper but gold in play)!

Not totally incorrect but we do have Lucius to help out and while build 4 is mediocre their cost is just excellent and they are super flexible :)

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11 minutes ago, Myyrä said:

My advice for playing 35ss Lucius games: Don't.

Support masters become relatively weaker in the smaller game sizes while beaters and summoners get stronger. You will be fighting an uphill battle if you choose to go with Lucius in a small game.

I concur with this post. I've tried Lucius at low point games and it rarely ever goes very well. He needs a wide variety of options on the table to get the most mileage and you don't really get that many models to use at 35ss. I actually tend to get more mileage out of Dashel leading my crews at 35ss than Lucius himself, as I can then front up 35 stones' worth of support for someone who summons off of a rather odd statline. (PSA: Dashel loves Sorrows)

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16 minutes ago, Masquer said:

Run the Emissary with Conflux of Tyranny, now Lucius is a trick beater. He can do all sorts of stuff with his AP, not just Issue Command. 

That makes him almost as good a beater as Hoffman is. That isn't very good in my books.

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Since the OP is going to a Beginner-oriented tournament I think we can back off with the overly competitive attitude. Newcius is good and fun to play now, and with Secret Objectives and his conflux turns into a surprising beater. Not to the level of the Lady J obviously but no one expects Lucius to do min 4 while discarding all their Search the Ruins markers at the same time.

If the scheme pool isn't very schemey (likely very rare now in GG2017) all Lucius has to do is walk a couple times with his Witchling Thrall squad and that's all the support you need. Put a couple Changelings in there too and you have four scary melee beaters ready to go. Hehe 

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39 minutes ago, Myyrä said:

That makes him almost as good a beater as Hoffman is. That isn't very good in my books.

Neither Hoffman nor Lucius are stand alone models, they need the correct support to be effective in their chosen role, whatever the role. If Lucius does not perform well with Conflux of Tyranny, it is because his crew does not support that tactic, not because it's "almost as good as something Hoffman is bad at."  

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1 hour ago, Masquer said:

Neither Hoffman nor Lucius are stand alone models, they need the correct support to be effective in their chosen role, whatever the role. If Lucius does not perform well with Conflux of Tyranny, it is because his crew does not support that tactic, not because it's "almost as good as something Hoffman is bad at."  

...or it's because the opponent used a more effective tactic. In this case that might be bringing a master that can actually put the hurt on something, if that is what you are intending to do with your master.

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I'm definitely not a fan of the conflux at 35 with Lucius. 

 

I find 35 pt games to often advantage schemes which value position over specific actions.    If the actions get too costly,  there just aren't enough actions to go around.   Maybe lucius with his action economy can free that up.   He'll be largely dependent on terrain to not get tabled though 

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1 hour ago, Myyrä said:

In this case that might be bringing a master that can actually put the hurt on something...

I must be mistaken then, you certainly have made it clear that my perspective on the subject is incorrect. I look forward to continuing to use Tyranny of Conflux in a manner that is paradoxical to reality.

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Captain Daschel is definitely worth considering now, especially in a lower point game.  He brings a couple of things to the table which can help make a big impact.

As a guardsmen he benefits from Lucius' plus flip aura and he is one of the Guild's only summoners.  Its one use per turn and resisted so you'll need a higher card, but its still pretty easy to pull off a Ca6 spell vs walk.  He also pairs well with his newly summoned friends with his own 0 focus aura.  Throwing down a couple of extra Guardsmen on the table can help put a kink in your opponents plans.

In a beginner's tournament I might stay away from Riflemen.  Especially with Lucius getting the 3 inch push trigger built into his Issue Command, they can be very difficult to pin down, and they can put out a lot of focus shots for bonus damage.  

Lucius loves Death Marshals.  They have higher will power, so have an easier time passing his horror duels than most, and Lucius can help them get into position to throw a deadly opponent into a box, or even just issue commands to let them do it more often.

Guild Pathfinders are always great for messing up an opponent's plan with clockwork traps, and while they are great on their own, they benefit a lot from working with Lucius.  

Lucius has gained a lot to help enforcers and henchmen thanks to the buff from commanding presence, but he still is at his best with minions thanks to elite training and issue command.  You can't really go wrong with Big ticket minions, the big ones I've had really positive experiences with so far are

New Guardian - 7ss, tough as nails, and he can heal with his buff.

Hunter - 7ss, lots of attacks, chain spear, and his own + flips.

Witchling Thrall - Big beatstick minion.

Warden - works best in guardsmen oriented crews where it can benefit from accomplice or a 0 focus action.

 

 

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15 hours ago, Corn said:

New Guardian - 7ss, tough as nails, and he can heal with his buff.

Hunter - 7ss, lots of attacks, chain spear, and his own + flips.

Witchling Thrall - Big beatstick minion.

I think i will go this way for the beaters and add some schemers. I hesitate between hounds and changelings...but since i never played chengeling i think i will try them!

So this list is composed of profiles that i never played before (guardian, thrall, hunter and changeling) or that had changed since i played them (Lucius ad scribe)...perfect for a beginner-oriented tournament.

- Lucius (cache : 4+1 ss)

    +Suprisingly loyal (1ss)

-Scribe (2ss)

- Guardian (7ss)

- Thrall (9ss)

- Hunter (7ss)

Changeling x 2 (8ss)

If i have a game against one of my vet players i will try the dashel list.

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An interesting trick to note with the Changelings is pairing them with Clockwork Traps and some Hunters (edit) which I believe is exclusive to Guild Lucius thanks to Surprisingly Loyal. In scheme pools favoring positional play, like guard the stash or stake a claim, you can deploy the traps in inconvenient positions, then move the Changelings near them to nab the trap's attack action. Then, if you chain spear someone in with a Hunter, the trap gets to attack, and the Changeling gets to attack twice as a result of Surprise and the wording on the trap action. Can be a great way to get a surprise damage burst going.

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