Suggestions for Future Errata

[Cadaverousbirth]

I don't want this to be a thread about crying over perceived OPness but about suggestions for small changes for the overall health of the game. Don't yell at Wyrd and demand that your scissors gets buffed and your opponent's rock gets cuddled. Relax. Anyway...

 

I would like to see Bayou Gaters get the Beast characteristic. I made a thread about this a while ago and was told that in playtesting it was too good with Marcus, so they were toned down but still don't have Beast. Marcus can Alpha a Sabretooth Cerberus, is it really so game breaking to Alpha a Gator? He can Alpha the Sow as well, so yeah. I want to buy these models but I can't justify it if I I'll literally never use it. Small change. More fun. Gators. 

Let the ideas flow!

[solkan]

Obligatory sideways reference to the line of sight rules.  

And an errata to the last paragraph of the action declaration rules to cover the revised Drinking Contest mechanic would be swell.  

[Squirrelich]

9 minutes ago, solkan said:

Obligatory sideways reference to the line of sight rules.  

I will continue to comment on fixing vantage point rules until the internet is no longer a thing or something is done about it. Not in a push hard or angry way, but in a I will not let them forget way.

[wizuriel]

An official timing guide for even things triggers / actions / abilities go off would also be nice, but I imagine that has to be a 3E change

[Dogmantra]

5 hours ago, solkan said:

And an errata to the last paragraph of the action declaration rules to cover the revised Drinking Contest mechanic would be swell.  

I'd like each step in taking an action to be broken down a bit more. For example picking a target and spending AP are both part of the same step, when do they occur in relationship to each other?

3 hours ago, wizuriel said:

An official timing guide for even things triggers / actions / abilities go off would also be nice, but I imagine that has to be a 3E change

Not necessarily. Guild Ball added some fantastic general timing flowcharts to the back of the rulebook starting with season 2 and as far as I remember there weren't really any changes required to put it into a nice flowchart format.

[koronuslight]

3 hours ago, wizuriel said:

An official timing guide for even things triggers / actions / abilities go off would also be nice, but I imagine that has to be a 3E change

Yeah, this could be done in this edition without any real issues. Just make a numerical list of when things are supposed to happen so there's no "that's not how we do things around here" when traveling to other places for events and tournaments. 

Because having to check a website during the middle of a game for something is irksome and ruins the mood. 

[Math Mathonwy]

I still stand by this:

 

[Four_N_Six]

I'm nitpicking for lack of any better ideas, but Brewmaster's ability and condition need to be name-swapped.  Swill should be the name of his attack, and Hangover +X should be what gives the  to everything.

[Fetid Strumpet]

At this point agree with Math's point about walls. All walls should disappear at the end of the turn.

Lady Justice needs something, and not something that gives her more mobility or killing power. Increasing any of those could break her. Especially since she just got taxi service via the emissary and staying power with the recruiter. 

But given that one of her biggest problems is that she can be more easily countered given that she doesn't fly or leap or have any way to clear a charge lane she needs something that allows her to have interesting choices to make that are not combat related. I would suggest an ability to 1 action control friendly guild marshalls with some bonus to the action, and possibly an action to give an aura that affects minions and guild marshalls that make the all better in some way in the aura.

She basically needs more interesting choices to make than just attack and kill. If you look at all the top tier masters that tends to be a common theme. They may excel in some area, but they do have multiple abilities that offer interesting choices and abilities to take even if one particular action is theoretically the strongest.

Ma needs something similar for the same reason.

Seamus needs something similar for the same reason. I know him best so while the conservative actions taken in the first wave made sense at the time they either need to be relaxed, and or other actions that are more interesting than focus jump (maybe and probably burn your 0 too) shoot. He also needs access to a useful 0 action that doesn't require additional resources to use. All his 0s require a corpse marker to be close by and either don't do anything on their own other than make another action more useful, or require another 2 resources (a highish card and a crow) to do anything. There are numerous suggestions I could make but I'll leave it there in this thread.

Vantage point and los rules need to be cleaned up to be more easy to use and more intuitive. They should be abstract and some logical disonnence is acceptable, but right now they are confusing and an absolute mess.

Terrain needs to more carefully defined as what is accually needed for a balanced game, and the players should have some actual rules supported agency in each game to set the terrain up.

 

[Dogmantra]

6 hours ago, Math Mathonwy said:

I still stand by this:

 

I like your argument a lot but there was an interesting point brought up by @Fetid Strumpet :  "Since terrain isn't standardized, nor is it something that has a mechanic to set up specifically, so that the players have some agency in altering the terrain to assist themselves, you are at the mercy of the board set up which is just going to make certain abilities better or worse. "

Which I think is interesting, since the "official" rules for setting up a table in the rulebook say to pick out terrain and then alternate placing it. Obviously that's not something that happens very often or is something that is even feasible for big organised play due to the time investment, but I think something that might be interesting for GG2016 would be to have a mandatory terrain modification section where each player can tweak the terrain before making crews. That's kind of off topic at this point and would work better for the future GG thread but eh it got brought up here.

(I think your errata is a much simpler way of making walls less annoying)

 

[Math Mathonwy]

5 hours ago, Fetid Strumpet said:

Ma needs something similar for the same reason.

I actually think that Mah has plenty of options due to her high mobility and plenty of Pushes.

[Bengt]

I think Mouse is pretty terrible, perhaps worth 2 SS with his current rules.

[Squirrelich]

51 minutes ago, Bengt said:

I think Mouse is pretty terrible, perhaps worth 2 SS with his current rules.

I certainly don't like him either. Make him a minion?

Or I can just learn to deal with it. Not sure at what point an errata becomes worth it when you have to redistribute cards.

[trikk]

33 minutes ago, Bengt said:

I think Mouse is pretty terrible, perhaps worth 2 SS with his current rules.

Governor`s Proxy called. He said you don`t know what terrbile means

[Kaptain_Konrad]

Nicodem to gain a pistol attack. Even a crappy sh4, just bothers me that it's on his model. Also would probably be broken but hiring any undead again. 

[KingJocko]

I don't consider this is a major issue, but similar to what happened to Tara and crew I'd like it if McMourning and his associated models got a unique characteristic for the purpose of playing both Guild and Ressurectionists. Both Study Group and Envoy have really limited pools to hire from seeing how Guild Guards are pretty much inferior when compared to Guild Autopsies and McMourning doesn't have a lot of poison tools in Guild to always justify Sebastian and the Zombie Chihuahua. Both the Lawyer and Nurse are unique additions, but as support units you'll rarely take more than one of them. I'd rather Sebastion, Nurses, and ZC have a medical themed characteristic, extend it to Rafkin, Orderlies, Nurse Heartsbane, and Dr. Grimwell, and replace Study Group and Envoy with something like Medical Residency: Crews led by this model may hire up to 4 models with the Med Staff Characteristic that are not the crew's declared faction. This would give Ressur McM more options without paying the Merc tax, Guild McM a new poison tool, and allow future additions with the same characteristic.

[Morgs]

Give me a reason to take guild guard.

[Rathnard]

Off the top of my head, here are some models I'd like to see get an errata one day:

Governors Proxy: He just needs to offer something useful because thus far, I've never seen him on the table. 

Guild Guard: I like that they get better when paired up, but they sadly just don't get good enough to be worth using.

Malifaux Raptor: This plus Interference or Practiced Production has been too silly for too long. At the very least, I feel like it should unbury at the start of the next turn (to reduce the interference abuse) and that it can't bury in the same turn it was unburied (so no yo-yo Raptors)

Thunder Archers: Too expensive, too fragile, too specialised and most importantly, costs about the same as three other 10-T shooters who are better at almost everything (Pathfinders, Samurai and Katanaka Snipers). It's a real pity because I love the models, but I just can't justify including them for any reason except LOLs. IMO they either need a complete rewrite or a drop to 5SS.

High River Monks: Too fragile for front line fighting, these guys seem best used as punchy scheme runners. But in a faction with Yokai, Tengu, Torakage and 10-T Brothers they don't really seem to compare.

Illuminated: Yeah. They're just a little too good for what you get.  At the very least I'd say the healing needs to be curtailed. 

Mah Tucket: To be honest I don't feel right adding her to the list just yet, mainly because I've never seen her on the table. She seems pretty lackluster though, and I get the impression she's taken Lucius's title as "The Internet's Worst Master". 

[MeatAndFauxtatoes]

I've only been in the game a little over a year but I would like to offer my thoughts on a few models:

Cojo: I would like a reason to hire Cojo from time to time as his model is great but his rules are not so fantastic - I am a new Marcus player and Cojo sticks out like a sore thumb. Currently I think he is not worth his 8ss. My biggest gripe with Cojo is his speed, WK 4 is too slow in a crew where everything else is at the least WK 5 or has a leap. I think leap would be a great way to make Cojo an attractive choice whilst being quite thematic. I think Cojo could also use a little durability as well in the form of hard to wound, more wounds or armor +1, although I worry that this could make him a little too good.

I would like to see bloody shears reworked for Kirai as they pale in comparison to Unforgiven. I know Kirai doesn't need anything else to help her in the competitive aspect but I think it would be nice to give her another compelling choice for the sake of variety. Giving her shears attack +1 ML for nearby spirits to a max of +2 or +3 with a killing blow trigger would be super interesting to me, the downside is that she can't use of pity and wind to summon.

Just daydreaming  and wanted to offer up a few thoughts. Well done on the recent errata Wyrd + playtesters I think it was a huge success 
 

[Clement]

11 hours ago, MeatAndFauxtatoes said:

I would like to see bloody shears reworked for Kirai as they pale in comparison to Unforgiven. I know Kirai doesn't need anything else to help her in the competitive aspect but I think it would be nice to give her another compelling choice for the sake of variety. Giving her shears attack +1 ML for nearby spirits to a max of +2 or +3 with a killing blow trigger would be super interesting to me, the downside is that she can't use of pity and wind to summon.
 

Really?  If any kind of killing is in the scheme poll with Kirai I have to fight to *not* take Bloody Shears.  Accomplice on a summoner is great.  Accomplice when combined with Swirl Spirits and Adversary is bonkers!  The charge and the melee attack I assume are just there for thematic reasons.

 

On topic:

Remember Desperate Mercenaries?  Has anyone found *any* use for the literal cover-boy of M2E?  I mean first edition they were great even if their only job was to troupe forward then get whanged in the head by Mortimer for corpses and healing.  This edition they just got...  bad.

[clockworkspide]

I might reach for one at 3 SS, if only as a space filler.  Though probably not often.

[Seadhna]

I'd love to see them either gain the Mercenary characteristic (so I Pay Better would be a thing) or the Bandit characteristic (for Parker shenanigans). 

They're still an okay model and an awesome scult, just they get outshined by every cheme runner out thefe. 

[Bengt]

30 minutes ago, Seadhna said:

I'd love to see them either gain the Mercenary characteristic (so I Pay Better would be a thing) or the Bandit characteristic (for Parker shenanigans). 

They're still an okay model and an awesome scult, just they get outshined by every cheme runner out thefe. 

Are we still talking about Desperate Mercenaries? Because they have the Mercenary characteristic already.

[Seadhna]

1 hour ago, Bengt said:

Are we still talking about Desperate Mercenaries? Because they have the Mercenary characteristic already.

Never noticed that. Then they're alright

[Mason]

On 1/10/2017 at 2:23 PM, Clement said:

On topic:

Remember Desperate Mercenaries?  Has anyone found *any* use for the literal cover-boy of M2E?  I mean first edition they were great even if their only job was to troupe forward then get whanged in the head by Mortimer for corpses and healing.  This edition they just got...  bad.

I use Desperate Mercenaries. They do pretty alright for their cost.

Scheme runners that are immune to charges can be pretty handy, and they do alright damage. People get really hung up on their attack stats of 4, but I think they're still solid. They show up alongside my Viks fairly often.