Outcasts Crew Box Reviews

[Freman]

Terrible, aren't we?

[TableTopical]

23 minutes ago, Freman said:

Terrible, aren't we?

i was being tempter by Dreamer, so its probably for the best that I bumped him down the list.

[Freman]

That's true. The only good Neverborn are Candy, Iggy, and Baby Kade, who run with Hamelin, and Teddy, Stitched Together, Hooded Rider, and the Undead models with Titania who can run with Leveticus.

[SoylentRobot]

oh dear what have we done

[TableTopical]

On 12/8/2016 at 9:07 PM, Freman said:

That's true. The only good Neverborn are Candy, Iggy, and Baby Kade, who run with Hamelin, and Teddy, Stitched Together, Hooded Rider, and the Undead models with Titania who can run with Leveticus.

I reallllyyy like Teddy. So what you're telling me is that I can buy Dreamer, get Teddy, and then still defend it to my wife as "No I'm not starting a new faction, this can all be used together!" ? I need to buy Levi...

[Freman]

Yes, Leveticus has the largest hiring pool in the game, either all Undead (except Gremlins) or all Constructs (except Gremlins) or all Riders with the Emissary (except Gremlins). I'm pretty sure that Wyrd are now a bit more stingy with the Undead and Construct keywords, knowing that they'll all end up with Leveticus.

[TableTopical]

12 minutes ago, Freman said:

Yes, Leveticus has the largest hiring pool in the game, either all Undead (except Gremlins) or all Constructs (except Gremlins) or all Riders with the Emissary (except Gremlins). I'm pretty sure that Wyrd are now a bit more stingy with the Undead and Construct keywords, knowing that they'll all end up with Leveticus.

I've definitely noticed the various opportunities across the factions to get you bought into other factions.. as a Tara player, I now own ressers for summoning with Karina. As a Misaki player, I now have 10T models... The first hit in a faction is always free I guess...

[DefyingReality]

5 minutes ago, TableTopical said:

I've definitely noticed the various opportunities across the factions to get you bought into other factions.. as a Tara player, I now own ressers for summoning with Karina. As a Misaki player, I now have 10T models... The first hit in a faction is always free I guess...

Sounds like someone has an excuse to pick up Yan Lo.

[Freman]

7 minutes ago, TableTopical said:

I've definitely noticed the various opportunities across the factions to get you bought into other factions.. as a Tara player, I now own ressers for summoning with Karina. As a Misaki player, I now have 10T models... The first hit in a faction is always free I guess...

Leveticus is one of those masters where you're either playing the faction, in this case Outcasts, or you're playing the master. If you're playing Outcasts then you'll generally be picking up a lot of Resurectionists. Nix can take Canine Remains (so with any master), Hamelin can take Crooligans, Karina summons Horror minions (and Tara is dual faction Resurrectionist), Jack Daw draws a lot of Tormented models from the Resurrectionists, and obviously Leveticus can take any Undead model (except Gremlins) which largely come from the Resurrectionists. While Misaki can't take any Resurrectionists as an Outcast, if you play her dual faction Ten Thunders there are models like Toshiro, Chiaki, and Izamu that she can hire there. It's why I regard Resurectionists as the natural second faction for an Outcast player. On the other hand if you're only playing Leveticus you may find yourself concentrating on Constructs in which case you'll be picking from multiple factions, but not a huge number of models per faction.

[SoylentRobot]

And then there are the handful of Undead Construct models like Necropunks, Students and Flesh Constructs, who you can take with either Pariah upgrade

[TableTopical]

20 hours ago, DefyingReality said:

Sounds like someone has an excuse to pick up Yan Lo.

20 hours ago, Freman said:

Leveticus is one of those masters where you're either playing the faction, in this case Outcasts, or you're playing the master. If you're playing Outcasts then you'll generally be picking up a lot of Resurectionists. Nix can take Canine Remains (so with any master), Hamelin can take Crooligans, Karina summons Horror minions (and Tara is dual faction Resurrectionist), Jack Daw draws a lot of Tormented models from the Resurrectionists, and obviously Leveticus can take any Undead model (except Gremlins) which largely come from the Resurrectionists. While Misaki can't take any Resurrectionists as an Outcast, if you play her dual faction Ten Thunders there are models like Toshiro, Chiaki, and Izamu that she can hire there. It's why I regard Resurectionists as the natural second faction for an Outcast player. On the other hand if you're only playing Leveticus you may find yourself concentrating on Constructs in which case you'll be picking from multiple factions, but not a huge number of models per faction.

11 hours ago, SoylentRobot said:

And then there are the handful of Undead Construct models like Necropunks, Students and Flesh Constructs, who you can take with either Pariah upgrade

You are all the devil.

Seriously though, I'm going to wait until after the holidays to decide whats next for me to write as far as masters go. I'm expecting to get a box or two of Malifaux stuff, so those will probably be my next articles :).

In other news, I've conscripted a few local gentlemen to guest post as well, so everyone can look forward to more than just my boring crew box reviews!

[Freman]

4 hours ago, TableTopical said:

You are all the devil.

Yes. Yes we are.

I tend to regard models that are both Undead and Constructs to be the "natural" recruits for Leveticus, since being both undead and construct is a feature of much of his themed crew. Off the top of my head that's the University of Transmortis models, Necropunks, Flesh Constructs, and Rogue Necromancy. All of which, it has to be said, are pretty decent models albeit (in the case of the Students) somewhat overspecialized.

[SoylentRobot]

It's a lot less painful if you collect Ressers first, since you can just grab Levi and Jack later on, since theyre both honorary Resser masters

[Fopp]

I'm absolutely tickled to see someone not fall for Schill as the place to start in Outcasts. I had a somewhat grueling start-up period for Malifaux almost entirely because I wasted time trying to get his box to work when there are simply better options. I perused plenty of "beginner guides", and I feel the community sometimes underestimates a beginners ability to pick up masters like Tara, and dumps them with masters like Schill.

From purely anecdotal experience, I second people's recommendations for Jack Daw, as that's the master that truly clicked for me.

[TableTopical]

 

On 12/20/2016 at 10:39 PM, Freman said:

Yes. Yes we are.

I tend to regard models that are both Undead and Constructs to be the "natural" recruits for Leveticus, since being both undead and construct is a feature of much of his themed crew. Off the top of my head that's the University of Transmortis models, Necropunks, Flesh Constructs, and Rogue Necromancy. All of which, it has to be said, are pretty decent models albeit (in the case of the Students) somewhat overspecialized.

As much as I love the fluff and model for Levi, I think I'll be waiting a bit before starting him up.  I'm resisting the urge to branch out into other factions as much as possible until I get and play everything in outcasts.  I know Levi would be a slippery slope for me lol. I have his cards though, so maybe I'll look them over and see if I get inspired ?

On 12/21/2016 at 4:17 AM, SoylentRobot said:

It's a lot less painful if you collect Ressers first, since you can just grab Levi and Jack later on, since theyre both honorary Resser masters

Nothing ever really jumped out to me in ressers.  I do like the look of Reva though...

On 12/28/2016 at 3:26 AM, Fopp said:

I'm absolutely tickled to see someone not fall for Schill as the place to start in Outcasts. I had a somewhat grueling start-up period for Malifaux almost entirely because I wasted time trying to get his box to work when there are simply better options. I perused plenty of "beginner guides", and I feel the community sometimes underestimates a beginners ability to pick up masters like Tara, and dumps them with masters like Schill.

From purely anecdotal experience, I second people's recommendations for Jack Daw, as that's the master that truly clicked for me.

I've played enough miniatures games to realize that I need to pick factions/miniatures that I like the theme of, as well as the mechanics.  Whenever I just get what people recommend, I play a few games, and then get bored. Playing the less beginner friendly masters also gives me a puzzle to solve, which I enjoy more than winning.

You will all be happy to know that I had a very good holiday in the minis department, so I will in fact be starting Jack Daw! I also got a bunch of other Outcasts models, so I'm thinking about testing them out and writing up some in depth stuff on them!

[Freman]

4 hours ago, TableTopical said:

 

As much as I love the fluff and model for Levi, I think I'll be waiting a bit before starting him up.  I'm resisting the urge to branch out into other factions as much as possible until I get and play everything in outcasts.  I know Levi would be a slippery slope for me lol. I have his cards though, so maybe I'll look them over and see if I get inspired.

Very wise. I ended up raiding every website I could find looking for old metals models (that was just before a lot of the 2.0 plastics were released), and consequently I have pretty much all the Resser faction along with my Outcasts. The highlight of that period was probably when Cool Mini or Not were clearing out their old metal stock and selling metal crew boxes for between eight and twelve dollars. I ended up buying a second Ramos box, just because it was the cheapest way to get spiders. I'm pretty sure they lost some money on their $9 shipping worldwide, but they sent out my $200 odd purchase (probably around $450 before their discounts) anyway. I also have fairly large chunks of the other factions in metal.

[TableTopical]

On 12/28/2016 at 3:26 AM, Fopp said:

I'm absolutely tickled to see someone not fall for Schill as the place to start in Outcasts. I had a somewhat grueling start-up period for Malifaux almost entirely because I wasted time trying to get his box to work when there are simply better options. I perused plenty of "beginner guides", and I feel the community sometimes underestimates a beginners ability to pick up masters like Tara, and dumps them with masters like Schill.

From purely anecdotal experience, I second people's recommendations for Jack Daw, as that's the master that truly clicked for me.

Inspired by your comment, I wrote up a  blog post this morning with my thoughts on how to pick your first malifaux master. As nerds we're pretty smart, and doing a "one size fits all" master recommendation for everyone seems to be a disservice for getting people the master that they'll truly enjoy.

http://tabletopical.com/picking-first-malifaux-master/

[Seadhna]

4 hours ago, TableTopical said:

Inspired by your comment, I wrote up a  blog post this morning with my thoughts on how to pick your first malifaux master. As nerds we're pretty smart, and doing a "one size fits all" master recommendation for everyone seems to be a disservice for getting people the master that they'll truly enjoy.

http://tabletopical.com/picking-first-malifaux-master/

You should probably reference this classic archetype article my Mark Rosenberg

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/timmy-johnny-and-spike-2013-12-03

 

It's about MtG, but the archetypes work in any competitive setting, really

[Freman]

My first master was Viktoria, because the heavy melee focus interested me. Of course, as of now, I've played exactly three games with her.

The master I've played the most with has been Hamelin, who at first I didn't get into because the imagery of a plague lord summoning hordes of rats didn't appeal, but then I thought of him as a piper, piping his way to power, and he began to feel much better.

In order of most games I've played.

Hamelin (Pikachu, I choose you)

Von Schill (Old Mr Reliable)

Jack Daw (I do like him, but there's a lot to think about while playing)

Viktoria (Killy killy death thing)

Leveticus (Undying pervert)

Tara/Parker (zero each)

Misaki (not even painted).

[randomhero125]

I have very limited experience in the game as it is just myself and my wife that paly at the moment. I personally think that the Viktorias are amazing as a starter. From what I have played so far they are very straight forward; see a target model, kill a target model. Crossing over from Ressers their play style has been very forgiving and a lot of fun. I enjoyed the Tara and Misaki. I really enjoyed the style of your reviews, very informative without getting too into the mire, and broken up for an easy read.

[TableTopical]

On 12/30/2016 at 4:34 PM, Seadhna said:

You should probably reference this classic archetype article my Mark Rosenberg

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/timmy-johnny-and-spike-2013-12-03

 

It's about MtG, but the archetypes work in any competitive setting, really

Ahh, I remember this article from back in the day. Good call! I gave the article it's own paragraph at the end for extra reading on the topic!  

On 12/30/2016 at 8:08 PM, Freman said:

My first master was Viktoria, because the heavy melee focus interested me. Of course, as of now, I've played exactly three games with her.

The master I've played the most with has been Hamelin, who at first I didn't get into because the imagery of a plague lord summoning hordes of rats didn't appeal, but then I thought of him as a piper, piping his way to power, and he began to feel much better.

In order of most games I've played.

Hamelin (Pikachu, I choose you)

Von Schill (Old Mr Reliable)

Jack Daw (I do like him, but there's a lot to think about while playing)

Viktoria (Killy killy death thing)

Leveticus (Undying pervert)

Tara/Parker (zero each)

Misaki (not even painted).

Any good tips for saving time in your Hamelin play? The whole rat engine really takes up alot of time! Also, I played a game with Jack Daw the other day, and I agree with your point about there being a lot of thinking involved. I feel like I spent more time staring at his and his crew's cards than actually playing the game! I think that I'll like the puzzle of him though, so I'm excited.

16 hours ago, randomhero125 said:

I have very limited experience in the game as it is just myself and my wife that paly at the moment. I personally think that the Viktorias are amazing as a starter. From what I have played so far they are very straight forward; see a target model, kill a target model. Crossing over from Ressers their play style has been very forgiving and a lot of fun. I enjoyed the Tara and Misaki. I really enjoyed the style of your reviews, very informative without getting too into the mire, and broken up for an easy read.

I agree that the Vics are a great way to start and learn the game! I personally don't like that playstyle too much, but I totally see the appeal of just deleting something off the table at a moments notice :). Thanks for the compliments on the articles as well, I'm really trying to figure out the best way I can share what I know, and help people getting into the game!

In other news, I wrote a new article in my "Picking your First Malifaux Master" series here. I created a Spreadsheet that shows what each of the masters focuses on, so I'm hoping it will be a good resource for newer players! I do want it to be community driven though, so let me know if you disagree with any of the ratings for your favorite masters!

[Seadhna]

2 hours ago, TableTopical said:

 

In other news, I wrote a new article in my "Picking your First Malifaux Master" series here. I created a Spreadsheet that shows what each of the masters focuses on, so I'm hoping it will be a good resource for newer players! I do want it to be community driven though, so let me know if you disagree with any of the ratings for your favorite masters!

I can only speak for Outcasts, but I'd rather give Parker sheme manipulation 1, control 2 and resource manipulation 3

he's no slouch in combat, but you won't be shooting too often with the new scheme pool, especially when there are incredible control options around (Hands in the air just plain shuts down up to three models a turn), and he's definitely not a melee expert as your table would suggest.

 

I would also swap Tara's Control 3 to Mobility 3, because her primary means of control is applying conditions, which is already represented in the table, while the Beast Bomb playstyle is very mobile and specific to Tara.

 

On a final note, I don't see any resource manipulation in Leveticus apart from card draw, so I'd go with Damage Casting 1, Mobility 2 (which also covers his resilience, since he will be taking damage and dying instead of enduring a punishment), Summoning 3 (Desolate soul and A&D are surprisingly reliable summoning tools, albeit only good for summoning abominations; but no-one is trying to be Nicodem in Outcasts anyway; because why would you the bald guy can't even Unmake anyone).

 

 

Otherwise, an extremely accurate table for Outcasts!

[Freman]

4 hours ago, TableTopical said:

Any good tips for saving time in your Hamelin play? The whole rat engine really takes up alot of time! Also, I played a game with Jack Daw the other day, and I agree with your point about there being a lot of thinking involved. I feel like I spent more time staring at his and his crew's cards than actually playing the game! I think that I'll like the puzzle of him though, so I'm excited.

The key with Hamelin, if you want to play to outactivate your opponent, is to engage just enough activations, but no more. For example if you need nine activations to outactivate, then you do nine activations, no more. Secondly if all you're doing is burning activations with rats, just point at a rat, "activate" and hand over. I rarely move a rat, they're just summoned, then turned into Rat Kings. I keep the models and the cards close to hand so it's just "pick up" "put down" "pick up" "put down".

Also, plan what you're doing with each model while your opponent is moving, especially if it's not going to involve an interaction with their models, they finish, you quickly do what you planned, then hand over. Of course that's helpful with any master, but especially so with summoners.

[TableTopical]

On 1/14/2017 at 1:28 PM, Seadhna said:

I can only speak for Outcasts, but I'd rather give Parker sheme manipulation 1, control 2 and resource manipulation 3

he's no slouch in combat, but you won't be shooting too often with the new scheme pool, especially when there are incredible control options around (Hands in the air just plain shuts down up to three models a turn), and he's definitely not a melee expert as your table would suggest.

 

I would also swap Tara's Control 3 to Mobility 3, because her primary means of control is applying conditions, which is already represented in the table, while the Beast Bomb playstyle is very mobile and specific to Tara.

 

On a final note, I don't see any resource manipulation in Leveticus apart from card draw, so I'd go with Damage Casting 1, Mobility 2 (which also covers his resilience, since he will be taking damage and dying instead of enduring a punishment), Summoning 3 (Desolate soul and A&D are surprisingly reliable summoning tools, albeit only good for summoning abominations; but no-one is trying to be Nicodem in Outcasts anyway; because why would you the bald guy can't even Unmake anyone).

 

 

Otherwise, an extremely accurate table for Outcasts!

Thanks for all of the feedback. I haven't played Parker before, so I figured I might be off base with him from just reading his card and the tactics I've been able to find =P. I've updated the table based on your feedback, let me know what you think!

On 1/14/2017 at 2:30 PM, Freman said:

The key with Hamelin, if you want to play to outactivate your opponent, is to engage just enough activations, but no more. For example if you need nine activations to outactivate, then you do nine activations, no more. Secondly if all you're doing is burning activations with rats, just point at a rat, "activate" and hand over. I rarely move a rat, they're just summoned, then turned into Rat Kings. I keep the models and the cards close to hand so it's just "pick up" "put down" "pick up" "put down".

Also, plan what you're doing with each model while your opponent is moving, especially if it's not going to involve an interaction with their models, they finish, you quickly do what you planned, then hand over. Of course that's helpful with any master, but especially so with summoners.

Great tips! I guess it also helps that since you have so many duplicate models on the field, you get to know their rules pretty quick. Their's less of that "I'll activate this guy... let me look at his card for 45 seconds to remember what my options are"

[Freman]

Oh yeah. I'm trying to learn Parker at the moment and there's a lot of that.