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Joel

Zipp - rather good fun

410 posts in this topic

'Hi,

So, I'm 4 games in with Zipp now - 1 club game last Monday and 3 games at a 30-player event yesterday.  I have 3 more today in another event.

I thought I'd start a thread on what I'm doing with him and his crew, the pool of models I'm using, and the schemes I'm choosing. 

How long I'll keep this up I have no idea, but it might be something to chat about.

Crew pool!

Firstly, I'm only running Zipp - single master - because he looks fun (he has an airship and can drop pianos on folks!!), so I have to make him work regardless of strategy and scheme pool. 

I have chosen to use a pool of models that I think work thematically together - but will admit that I don't have many models from the gremlin range and have been wanting to keep a tight reign on my spending on this project, so it's not getting out of hand.

the pool currently stands at:

zipp crew box (obviously)

merris (because she also has a jet pack)

sparks (to help earl out in engineering)

burt and Gracie (I can see the braggart action hero and Zipp verbal battles, and his pet pig is s must if you take Burt IMO as they are a team in the fluff)

gremlin taxidermist (ship's cook/doctor/ammo provider)

stuffed piglets (pushing these over the side like the pianos is a mental picture that makes me giggle)

pere ravage (ship's tactical officer) 

pigapult (since I can't arm the ship with cannons in Malifaux yet, this will have to do!) this model hasn't been built yet, I'll be doing that during the next week.

trixibelle and McTavish (added as they were models I owned.  Trixi at least is the crew's....entertainment.  I can't think of a fluff reason for McTavish, but I like my proxy.  Honestly, at this point I can't see myself using either, but I'll leave them in for now)

I've not used everything yet. Still on the bench are:

merris

sparks

pere ravage

(and pigapult, Trixi, McTavish as described above)

but I aim to fix some of that today in my second event with the gang. 

 

Set up!

I'm going upgrade heavy so far. Zipp encourages this with his limited upgrades anyway.

on Zipp:

ive been taking gift of the gab and rambling diatribe as standard and varying the last upgrade. In that last slot I've gone with hovering airship once, do over once and dirty cheater twice. 

Gift of the gab has had no effect because I've not had Zipp in the right parts of the board or I've forgotten about it. It has given me free upgrades though, so it's worth it for that.

rambling diatribe has been great.  I tend to target my own crew with this to get rid of rubbish from my hand and recharge it (and get a scrap marker). 

Of the others, do over has some synergy with diatribe but I'm not sure about it yet.  Dirty cheater has healed a couple of wounds in one game, and I'd consider it if neutralise the leader is in the pool.

The airship was good on him as he's mobile enough to put out multiple pianos a turn, something the skeeters do a lot less well when they carry it.  I want to try this on him more - it's never going to be dropped from the crew, it's just a question of who carries it.

on First Mate:

ive used him in all my games, and always with the upgrades treasure map and where the captain can't see.

when opponents drop scheme markers, he's golden.  Otherwise, these upgrades feel like a waste, not so much that I'd feel like dropping him from the list, but I may have found a carrier for dirty cheater if Zipp isn't using it.

the combo of abilities, and his own ability, make for a potent mix.

on skeeters:

ive used spotlight once, when I used 3 skeeters in my first game.  In the event yesterday, I used 2 skeeters in all 3 games and took airship on one and explosives on the other.  

I have dropped pianos and enjoyed it, but want to drop more! I've not used any action on either of the other two, but I found myself missing the spotlight one in 2 games yesterday. 

I think whichever one I drop I'll suddenly see a need for in the next game I play.

other upgrades:

ive used dirty cheater on Burt 3 times.  It's been good on him, topping him up above hard to kill and I think I'd always give him a copy if I ran him.  I've not upgraded anything else to date.

 

thats all I've got time for right now as I need to get ready for the event - I'll get back to you with an update this evening.

Joel

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If the opponent doesn't need to drop scheme markers, you can use the upgrade on Skeeters that makes them drop a scheme marker and gain slow, then have the First Mate get rid of the marker to cycle 2 cards and gain armor.  Not the most effective thing to do, but it's also on the Skeeter upgrade that makes stuff explode, which I'm convinced I can make work.

I think running Zipp in any scheme/strat pool is a great idea.  He can easily disrupt positioning of your opponent so that your crew can score points unopposed.

Also, I really like the new fluff idea to make existing models part of the airship crew.

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I'm a big advocate of First Mate with Hovering Airship. Hes got a free movement so you can leap 7 focus and drop the piano. You can also soulstone for the positive damage flip or movement triggers. Ill take Where the Captian cant See just as an anti scheme safety valve. Doubleing up on treasure map just feels like wasting slots on a potential pay off you cant guarantee.

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So i've been using Zipp for the last month quite often and just today i arrived 3rd at a local tournament thanks to the rambling pirate :) Although i don't run Zipp in every scenario, i tend to run him very often and if it wasn't that somer is so good when there are schemes and certain objectives requiring a large number of units (interference for example), i think he's really hard to deal with, having a really nice mixture of utility\mobility\damages. And in any way it's such a cool crew that i find myself always wanting to play it just for the aesthetic factor XD So this being said i'll share the mindset and crew i usually run with him :)

So as Joel, I like to run Zipp fully upgraded, usign almost always  ''Rambling diatribe'' (to remember is a really good way to cycle some bad cards if you have an awfoul hand and to give earl some scrap markers) and ''Gift of gab'' (you can prevent someone to use 0 actions anyway with the zapper if you need it), plus a ''defensive'' upgrade which may varies from ''Stilts'' to ''Liquid bravery''. I don't like taking skypirtes uogrades on him because i think his ap are better spent on his printed ability which are so good! The zapper is really annoying for the enemy, the smoke markers are really good in the right position, but the one that shines the most for me is ''Up we go'': this attack is so strong (i ve already killed 4 masters with this attack since it bypass all Df triggers, all resistence and let them just cheat with soulstones, which are usually limited ), as so much potential paired with Earl (which i never leave at home) Regular manteinence, and almost assure you the attack to go off with a 13 unless you're attacking a Ht3 model. So what Zipp generally does is focus down key targets for the scheme\strat pool by either repositioning\ killing them or support his crew with heither the rope or the smokebombs (which i generally do on turn 1\2 if the game is going slow).

Than, regarding the Iron skeeters , I usually run one with treasure map, which mainly works as a taxy for either Burt or\and Francois (the latter in particular, since if you're able to reposition an enemy in the right way, you can than companion into francois to finish the job, and quick murder is that way done! ), while the other take Hovering air ship (a really good threat to enemy scheme runners and really good to secure stuff like hunting party). Their role is mainly of support\menace, in particular the one with treasure map mainly use his ap to bring pieces around and work as a secondary scheme runner. I think they're really good pieces and i find really hard not to bring at least 2.

About the  First mate, i must say, i love this piece so much, it's for sure my favourite among the skypirates! It's a solid piece imo, although kinda expansive, which has great statistics and a lot of ways to ruin the enemy plans. I generally use him in 2 ways: as a scheme runner/scheme denier (although since i took merris, the 1 option kinda fade off, and became more situational), or as a 2\3 turn tank which focus his ap on slowing and repositioning enemy models in order to deny them Vp. The first way is kinda easy to assume, sicne it's his main purpose, and equip him with both his personal upgrade and treasure map (at that point the skeeter gets poorly handled explosives or airship spotlight), while the ther way is accomplished equipping the Mate with his personal upgrade and poorly handled explosives: this way he leaps to the target, give out the condition to drop a marker, lure him out in order to remove the target, having in result +1 armor, a card cycle (2 if close to trasue map) and if well positioned an attack outform pounce. It might seem kinda tricky,but after da couple of succesful match i can tell you it's not that hard since you usually wanna focus some low stat models (a mister graves for example), in order to force the enemy to waste cards defending him or letting you get beefy and rich, whiile maybe paralizing some enemies if you're lucky. To keep in mind tho that it's not always a good idea to hire the Mate, since he's really expansive as a model, and sometime is a better idea to go over something else.

From here my crew is usally filled up with a scheme runner (merris is so good for it, otherwise trixiebell or something on tat line), 1 or 2 beater depending on the scenario (tho i always had burt+francois with me lately) and a couple of minions or stuffed ( which can be launched by zipp too with Up we go ;) ) depending on what's needed. If i can i try to save up to have at least 5\6 stones, since i find myself to use them quite often with him (tho you have ways to get them back with treasure map).

Hope i gave some good ideas and would love to hear what you think about it, also becausein my opinion zipp is so good, and would love to see moore people sharing their opinions on him ;)  

 

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Didn t want to edit out the post, but the reason i prefer to use poorly handled explosives on the mate rather tan on the skeeters is beacuse i think he's way moore reistent and has better ways to select the right target or to escape a sticky situation, while the skeeters are kinda fragile and i don't like to expose them too much. Another reason is that by doing that combo, i odn't give th epossibility to my enemie to discard or make use of the marked dropped.

 

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I'm back! 😀 

3 more games today - won 2, lost 1.  That puts me at 6 out of 7 today. 

I used Merris and Pere Ravage in games today, experimented with hiring multiple stuffed piglets and moved upgrades around again.

I put hovering airship back on Zipp for 3 games - got lots of use out of it, but I'm now interested in trying it on the first mate given what has been posted above. 

I think Merris and the first mate are an either/or choice. You don't need both in one list.  

The gremlin taxidermist was pretty good in all games, gave him do over, it's a pretty marginal upgrade now in my eyes and ill probably drop it.

I'm still undecided on the number of skeeters that is optimal, I still haven't got much out of their upgrades. Giving one treasure map might be the way forward.

more testing to come soon!

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Some of the initial thoughts I have had with Zipp around upgrades are one of his limited upgrades and rambling diatribe are a must. The third depends on who I am facing and what the schemes are but I will typically take liquid bravery if Neverborn are announced. If neutralise the leader is in I like on your tip toes to discard to redo the duel. The other upgrade that is golden on Zipp is spotlight. 

Spotlight means that you can go early with Zipp and light up whichever model you want Skeeters to drop pianos on. This way you get round the cover issue and so can opt to drop 2 pianos instead of do using and dropping 1. The other reason I like it on Zipp is he can stone for the suit for the triggers. Making perdita or Ophelia need to discard 2 cards or be unable to shoot really annoys the opponent. 

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If I can't find the AP to drop pianos with Zipp, I think I'd really struggle to use spotlight over his normal actions instead - but its worth testing out to see.

on doubling-up on first mate (where the captain can't see and treasure map): one thing I've found with this combo is that it flat-out forces opponent scheme selection in the pre-game.  You tell them what it all does and they write off all the scheme marker schemes from the decision making process.  

Either way, you gain advantage as either you know what schemes they are planning or you simply capitalize on them trying to drop the markers anyway.  

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after getting my copy of book 4 back from a friend and reading the Zipp story, I've decided I need a to get a mechanical porkchop and convert it into an iron skeeter for Roscoe :)

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36 minutes ago, wizuriel said:

Anyone tried fingers with zip and just shut down interacts?

I have, but that's partly because I almost always hire 40 stone crews because I want Fingers to be there every time.  So far the auras from each of them hasn't played a huge role.  Fingers more than Zipp, for sure.  Zipp's aura has only ever stopped an opponent once for me, they usually have the cards to burn.  For a while though, I just forgot he had that ability, because my memory isn't the best when it comes to new models.

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8 hours ago, Joel said:

If I can't find the AP to drop pianos with Zipp, I think I'd really struggle to use spotlight over his normal actions instead - but its worth testing out to see.

Basically I view the 3rd upgrade on Zipp to be dependent on opposing faction and schemes

If I am facing ressers or Neverborn I will probably put liquid bravery on him to help with the willpower duels. If I am against guild or gremlins spotlight is something I would take just for the ability to shut down Sh attacks on a trigger. 

If neutralise the leader is in the pool On your tip toes will possibly go on Zipp. I generally don't take dirty cheater on Zipp as I like Sparks with Zipp and he can turn Zipp into a construct so that Earl can heal him. 

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Sparks is one of the models I have yet to test with Zipp, I guess that's my next game 😀

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Currently thinking that sparks using his explosives action, then chain activating into Zipp to up we go the target 3 times could be a good way to get those blasts doing a lot of work

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Hmm - sparks uses "packed with explosives" on a stuffed piglet near Zipp and accomplice into Zipp.  Zipp uses "up we go" on the stuffed piglet dropping it near 2 enemy models and cheating down the pig's defence to get a severe damage through.

pig takes 5, enemy models take 4 each - then pig explodes for maybe 4 more 😀

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1 hour ago, Joel said:

Hmm - sparks uses "packed with explosives" on a stuffed piglet near Zipp and accomplice into Zipp.  Zipp uses "up we go" on the stuffed piglet dropping it near 2 enemy models and cheating down the pig's defence to get a severe damage through.

pig takes 5, enemy models take 4 each - then pig explodes for maybe 4 more 😀

Devious, just like Zipp 

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Pandora won't like it 😈

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Played a few games with him and I agree is is a blast to play with lots of things that he can do in most situations.   

With Sparks, a stuffed opens up a ton of options including same setup but noxious smoke so the stuffed is just 2 away and Zipp is blocked off then shooting/melee stuffed with Zipp and then get the blasts to hit things that the -2 walk and no charge or 0's. So if they live they aren't doing much... Also avoids pesky high defenses and most DF triggers and does a great job of neutering a lot of models.  

I love using the smoke to be placed to pen in a rng 1 Ml model pretty well and still be in Zipps engage of 2.  also another fun fact is he can take the drop attack as a disengaging strike against high DF models.  

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The last game I played I used Poorly Handled Explosives on Zipp. He turned people into living grenades that then were thrown at their own allies. I was pretty happy with it.

Being able to place the target to maximize that 4 damage it great when the opponent doesn't get a chance to react before you throw them.

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Here is a nasty combo for you all:  

Take Pere Ravage with Zipp and an Iron Skeeter and have poorly handled explosives on something (doesn't matter what).  

1 - Activate whatever has poorly handles explosives, casting it on Pere. 

2 - Activate the skeeter, using it's ability to drag a HT 1 model (Pere) along for a ride and move it toward a clump of enemies, and hopefully giving Pere fast. 

3- Activate Pere, going reckless, move into position within 2" of as many enemies as possible (you should charge if in range) then oopsie twice, using the extra two AP from reckless and fast. 

It will kill Pere, but it has the potential to do  a TON of damage to everything nearby!  It has the potential to do up to 18 damage (10 from oopsie, 4 from Pere blowing up, and 4 from PHE) to every model in 2" if they fail their oopsie saves, and is guaranteed to do 8 damage to everything in 2" (4 from Pere blowing up, and 4 from PHE), also possibly 10 damage to everything in 6" , and that's not even counting his damage on the charge target!.  I have literally wiped out 3/4 of my opponents crew in one go with this trick!  Also, if you need extra speed from Pere before he pops, use Zipp's 0 action "Grab a Rope" to push him even farther up field!  or you can use Zipp to "up we go" models into position for the big boom.  Burt works well with this combo too, because of Cracker Jack Timing.

Now, my job done, I race into the clouds!!!

 

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the issue comes is an opponent spreading out when he sees you've hired pere.  I tried this in my last game at the weekend and although I managed to detonate pere with decent effect, it wasnt worth the setup time and cost.  This might be something I need to practice.

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6 hours ago, Sketch201 said:

Here is a nasty combo for you all: 

Take Pere Ravage with Zipp and an Iron Skeeter and have poorly handled explosives on something (doesn't matter what). 

1 - Activate whatever has poorly handles explosives, casting it on Pere.

2 - Activate the skeeter, using it's ability to drag a HT 1 model (Pere) along for a ride and move it toward a clump of enemies, and hopefully giving Pere fast.

3- Activate Pere, going reckless, move into position within 2" of as many enemies as possible (you should charge if in range) then oopsie twice, using the extra two AP from reckless and fast.

It will kill Pere, but it has the potential to do  a TON of damage to everything nearby!  It has the potential to do up to 18 damage (10 from oopsie, 4 from Pere blowing up, and 4 from PHE) to every model in 2" if they fail their oopsie saves, and is guaranteed to do 8 damage to everything in 2" (4 from Pere blowing up, and 4 from PHE), also possibly 10 damage to everything in 6" , and that's not even counting his damage on the charge target!.  I have literally wiped out 3/4 of my opponents crew in one go with this trick!  Also, if you need extra speed from Pere before he pops, use Zipp's 0 action "Grab a Rope" to push him even farther up field!  or you can use Zipp to "up we go" models into position for the big boom.  Burt works well with this combo too, because of Cracker Jack Timing.

Now, my job done, I race into the clouds!!!

 

I'd talked about this on our Facebook group, but instead of Zipp, running it with Wong and making Pere the Glowy model, so all those explosions ignore Hard to Kill and Armor.  Damage from his tactical action won't be increased, but it'll still ignore those defensive abilities, and his attack would get the +1 if you have a need for using it instead of just blowing up.

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I'm going to be testing machanised porkchops with Zipp soon - taking a wound to gain pos flips on attacks when charging could be very useful, plus it'd feed Earl and Sparks the easy scrap marker.

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19 hours ago, Joel said:

Pandora won't like it 😈

My suspicion is Pandora already hates Zipp because he can Suplex her all day with "Up we go!" and she just has to take it.  No swapping in WP, no pushing, just pain.

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Yeah, but at 2 damage a go most likely - she can hit him back much harder.  Adding the blasts/pulses into it could drop her in an activation

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