Can anyone explain the lack of TT players?

[Eclipse]

Probably the reason why being out-activated can be scary is because there are crews that can take advantage of this in ugly ways, such as waiting out the opponent's activations with Rats and then charging in with the Viks, or p00ping out scheme markers for with Colette's crew or whatever. While the reason why we can do well with more elite lists as TT is probably because we are flexible and have ways to mitigate disadvantages such as luck of the draw, etc.

...Aaaand a sample list with many models without summoning/recurring with decent (heh) holding and killing power:

Jacob Lynch - 1ss cache
Hungering Darkness
+ Recalled Training 1ss
Sensei Yu 9ss
+ Wandering River Style 2ss
Mr. Graves 8ss
2x Illuminated 14ss
4x Depleted 16ss

Who said Misaki is the only TT Master who can alpha-strike? Hungering Darkness can do it too! (And reveals himself as the mastermind in the process :P)

[InvokeChaos]

In the vein of the out-activation thing and just because I haven't seen a comparison like this...

If you look at what we have that costs 5ss or less:

Clockwork Trap - 2ss
Fermented River Monk - 5ss
Komainu - 5ss
Monk Of Low River - 4ss
Oiran - 5ss
Rail Worker - 5ss
Shadow Effigy - 4ss
Ten Thunders Brother - 5ss
Tengu - 4ss
Wastrel - 4ss

Traps and Wastrel are really situational. FRM, LRM, Rail Workers are seem to be really hit or miss. 10T Bros, Shadow Effigy, and Komainu are all really solid to good. I personally like Tengu and Oiran, but I've seen a lot of meh feelings for those models.

So if you go with the solid options, we have 3 models that cost 5ss that you could probably safely field any time and they do work. 

Versus:

Guild: Hounds for 3ss (pretty damn good) and some other stuff that's pretty solid, but i'm not too familiar with, so I won't comment.
Arcanists: Raptors for 3ss (amazing), various gamin and steam arachnids for 4ss (typically pretty solid) and performers for 5ss (sweet jeebus)
Outcasts: Rat engine... I don't think anything else needs to be said here
Rezzers: there are so many... Crooligans for 4, night terrors for 3, canine remains for 4, necropunks for 5... and they summon. JEEBUS
Neverborn: tots, depleted (why are these so cheap!), insidious madness, iggy
Gremlins: bayou gremlins are all I need to list here. there's more i'm sure... but bayou gremlins.

Most of those options for the other factions are really good choices. Honestly, the only go-to model for me tends to be 10T bros. But we seem to be ok with our our lower SS cost options. 

I think the point of contention is that our really good models start at the 7ss range: sniper, archers, illuminated... but I think it's fairly easy to get 7-8 activations if we keep the brute squad concept to a minimum. i personally love running elite lists, but they do tend to suffer in the activation war.

Also, let's not forget McCabe and Lynch... both of which do really well with activations. Lynch can run huggy for free and depleted (which are amazing super cheap tarpits), and McCabe can practically run all minions and be totally fine. The typical Luna + 3 dogs is 13 pts and 4 activations. It's no rat engine, but you can easily get upwards of 10 activations with McCabe and not lose any power. 

[Eclipse]

2 hours ago, InvokeChaos said:

Most of those options for the other factions are really good choices. Honestly, the only go-to model for me tends to be 10T bros. But we seem to be ok with our our lower SS cost options. 

I think the point of contention is that our really good models start at the 7ss range: sniper, archers, illuminated... but I think it's fairly easy to get 7-8 activations if we keep the brute squad concept to a minimum. i personally love running elite lists, but they do tend to suffer in the activation war.

I agree with what you say about our lower SS options. haven't tried 10T Bros yet because I'm still waiting for the plastics to come out, instead I resort to Oiran for cheap activations, besides most of the time I play 10T I tend to mess around - and they are quite OK then. Komainu are solid, the Effigy is awesome (Notice how we are probably the only faction that can marvel over an Effigy, even though it's not the best one? That sure tells a lot).
We do have two good models in the 6ss range too, Pathfinders are amazing and I have absolutely no idea why very few people seem to to field them (unless with McGabe?). Obsidian Oni are also going to be awesome, on paper for now at least. 

[InvokeChaos]

I like Obsidian Oni, but he's a mid-range model with df/wp5 and 6wds. Yeah, he has armor, but without anything else he just seems a bit glassy for me.

I suppose the idea is to hold them back until they can charge in, do a nice bunch of damage and then let them die with explosive demise hopefully finishing the job... but for 1ss more you get illuminated. With armor, regen, higher defenses and another wd. I do think the utility of Obisidan's Flames from the Heavens is strong.

I REALLY want to like them, and I am hoping the new master gives them a reason to be loved!

Aren't pathfinders mercs? I keep hearing they are really good, but again... 1 more gets you a sniper, which is so good.

Though that's a valid point maybe? Every time you go "but yeah this one is so good for just one more point" you are taking points away from your bottom line. So maybe running an obsidian and pathfinder, which is a 2pt net right there, isn't a bad idea?

[SinJ]

The Pathfinder is not a merc, just dual faction Guild/TT. The Pathfinder is a cheap shooter that ignores Armor on trigger. He "can" also create clockwork traps which can be a royal PITA. I find myself reaching for the Katanaka sniper when I know my master will likely die  (Misaki) or with Shen Long. Otherwise Trappers are generally a very solid choice.

[Yvarre]

I've found that I've been able to mitigate the activation war against things like the rat engine and summoning masters by having some low stone schemers (hounds) or Depleted to soak up activations and then by keeping up a constant body count.  In a Lynch crew, this is usually pretty easy, and I often average 2 models a turn starting turn 1 except on Corner Deployment.  That kind of a list makes sure that the Beckoners, a model which I personally find worth the stones in TT, aggressively make their early lures so Huggy and Lynch use all of their AP killing, but being 4 models down at the end of turn 2 can be quite game breaking even for a summoning crew that's counting on gaining more activations from some of the less stellar models that might come in on lower cards.  Chances are good that they may have also burnt some good cards or stones to keep that Henchman alive, and I've isolated and killed many a master on turn 2.

Ditto also to McCabe's dirty dogs, and he's no slouch at getting across the board and killing what needs killing.  I have had McCabe crews torn apart by Molly a couple of times, though.

It is true that Ressurs and Gremlins are showing some great competitive results this year, and I think that's in no small part to the activation control potential of these factions.  It always surprises me, though, that Outcasts don't put out great competitive results even though they have one of the best self-contained activation control engines and Leveticus.

This all said, I'm pretty excited at the potential to have a summoning master in the faction as Recon and Interference can be quite tricky against the likes of Dreamer or Kirai, not impossible- just steeped in ectoplasm running through the streets.

[Skitt_Happens]

On the subject of interference: I played a game of it against Molly in a tournament earlier in the year - I lost, but it was close and in hindsight I can see two very simple decisions that I got wrong and could have won me the game.

What worked well though, was using smoke and shadows on a jorogumo. Dropping a 50mm base with 3"  into the middle of opponents crew at the end of turn 1 or 2 is brutal. Joro just sat where she was battering everything around her. My opponent was forced to feed his models to her to stop her rampaging through his back line.

Just throwing it out there: it doesn't matter if you are out activated if you can dictate what your opponent is using his ap for.

[Eclipse]

10 hours ago, InvokeChaos said:

I like Obsidian Oni, but he's a mid-range model with df/wp5 and 6wds. Yeah, he has armor, but without anything else he just seems a bit glassy for me.

I suppose the idea is to hold them back until they can charge in, do a nice bunch of damage and then let them die with explosive demise hopefully finishing the job... but for 1ss more you get illuminated. With armor, regen, higher defenses and another wd. I do think the utility of Obisidan's Flames from the Heavens is strong.

  These stats are perfectly solid with the Armor slapped on. So long as their Walk remains 5 I am completely fine with fielding the Obsidian Oni. Still better then Torakage for me (I don't play McGabe :P) More importantly, the Oni are combo pieces. Their Ca attack gets + flip on damage against Burning targets... So put them on fire with Dawn Serpent, Shenlong, Mei Feng... Well, probably not High River Monks  Charge in when you need to reinforce your first line of offence or are intending to push forward.
The Oni can and will give a scrap marker with the Ca attack on the right trigger when used against enemy models, so make use of that with Mei Feng or even better, Toshiro and his Komainu buddies.
  In addition, they can (0) heal 2 Wd on a non-Master with an upgrade. Perfect for those moments when you bring Shadow Emissary, Samurai, someone with Hidden Agenda, etc. The reason I value them highly is because they can do a lot of stuff, they are toolbox models. Which fits the way I see our faction  In addition, the Emissary has a (0) that reduces enemy Df by up to -2 if they are on fire, so you can easily make two casting attacks with straight or positive against most models. Scary. Theoretically even more brutal with one other piece, but I will save this for another time
  Guild Pathfinders on the other hand combo against other models. They can solo perfectly well (at least until they become engaged). The Clockwork Traps are 60% or their game, if you don't put out traps they won't pull their weight. If you bring two Pathfinders you can also combo them by having one drop a trap and the other toss the trap even further up the board. Great for blocking lanes, engaging shooters, wasting AP, giving slow on models that can't (or won't) cheat when they fail the Walk duel. Very, VERY annoying for the opponent  Also a useful springboard for models with Smoke and Shadows who can engage 4"+ base 1" + 6" + base 1" + 6" from Shadow Stride = up to 18" + their base + engagement range away from the first Pathfinder.
  Additionally, the Pathfinders' guns are quite strong. So long there is a trap or two 2" away from the target you can safely focus and shoot to randomize into enemy territory and possibly even behind LoS (!), ignoring cover from the Focus and fighting for blasts with the + to damage. A damage track of 2/4B/5B is very, very solid. If you hit the trigger on Masks (I think?) to ignore Armor this also gets applied to the blast, I have checked this. Alternatively, on a high Crow you can easily slow the initial target regardless of Traps, etc.
The only reason I play them so little now is because I already have a lot of other models to field, as well as because seeing my opponents squirm and curse when they see dual Pathfinders got old at some point  

[InvokeChaos]

yeah the reliance on those traps actually is why I don't personally like the pathfinder, but I keep forgetting they can ignore armor, so maybe I should give them another look.  

And valid points on the obsidian. And I know what you mean... theoretically

I have yet to put Mei Fang on the table... they seem like a solid choice for her.