Wondering if this is a fair fight...

[Zedicius]

Right, so I got interested in Malifaux roughly two months ago. However due to some shipping delays I haven't been able to collect a playable crew yet. Out of frustration I took a train to the nearest hobby store to buy a crew box I hadn't ordered already just so I could have some malifaux-related things to do while waiting for my other stuff to arrive, even though I'm itching to finally start playing. Now I'm having two friends over tomorrow for a board game night and I was wondering if threw everything I currently have together, if it would make a playable game. What I have is the starter set, the Hoffman crewbox and a Rail Golem and I was hoping a 2 vs 1 scenario might work.

The starter set for both crews is 38 stones in total (19 each), excluding the two henchmen as they'll be serving as leaders.

The Hoffman kit is 28 + 3 (field mechanic & arcanist ties) + 11 (Rail Golem) for a total of 42 stones.

Technically, dropping the watcher would reduce the Hoffman crew to 38 as well, but this still feels a bit too strong when put against two starter set crews, so I think it might be best to drop one of the two hunters instead, which would make the following lists;

Guild Crew; (Grimwell, Nurse, Orderly, Orderly, upgrade) 19 stones
Neverborn Crew; (Angel eyes, Shaman, Wretch, Wretch, upgrade) 19 stones

VS

Tiny Hoffman Ball (Hoffman, Guardian, Attendant, Watcher, Hunter, Rail Golem, Field Mechanic, Arcanist Ties) 33 stones

I'm aware that Master vs Henchmen games aren't played, though unfortunately I only have one master. Obviously this is by no means meant to be a proper game... mostly something to have fun with, while teaching my friends the rules at the same time.

Would this turn out to be enjoyable in any way, or would this be an utterly bad idea and a one-sided game?

[Gnomezilla]

I've cobbled together a few silly matches at this point, but never with a points or composition imbalance that high. Can you play the ParanParanoiaoia 3-player setup (I think there's a link embedded within that doubled "Paranoia" now, try clicking it) with 3 equal, tiny crews?

Drop Hoffman & attendant, make the Rail Golem your leader & ignore the need for arcanist assets (and if your opponents agree allow it to use soul stones as a henchman), build up to 19 stones (just add guardian, watcher, hunter), give everyone the same small cache?

Also do you have any books with stats such that the Hoffman or mechanical attendant minis can be used to proxy anything else? They otherwise aren't useful to the other mini-crews. I suppose you can leave the other hunter on the field as an interact target and play extraction, or interact with it 1AP=hunter takes a 1AP action (suddenly Team Asylum has a shooting attack or Team Horns has threatening melee or Team This Device Has No Melee Power When Not Looped has something else with a decent melee stat).

[-Loki-]

Maybe expand the starter crews a touch? Add some Guild Riflemen to the Guild and Terror Tots to the Neverborn? That should being both up to near 30pts.

[Gnomezilla]

Heartsbane and a hunter have equal value, I think. You could give Team Asylum a hunter instead of her, and have her be an interact target for all three crews as they fight to electroshock themselves or others. Or whatever else she does, I don't have her card memorized.

Also this puts constructs into two crews, and if you want to say the Neverborn have stolen Guild technology (I blame Lucius) swap their scion of black blood for the other hunter, put Heartsbane into the rail golem's crew instead of either hunter, now you have all three crews with constructs squabbling over who gets to order Hoffman to install their upgrades first. After all, once it's attached it won't be available again until that construct dies. Recycling!

[Zedicius]

So not a good idea then

From what I read I'm assuming the Hoffman crew is still over-powered even when he's lacking 5 soul stones? Could someone give me a quick estimate what the outcome would be of my original setup? Remember, it's a 2vs1 not a free-for-all.

I'm afraid I only have the small paper-back rulebook, so no extra stat cards. Making tweaks to the list is going to be difficult. I also thought about leaving the Rail Golem out all together and just play with the vanilla hoffman box set, though I'm not sure how much of an impact this will have. I would say that kicking Hoffman himself off the team sounds like a good idea, though I've only played a bunch of games with the starter set, so I really don't have enough experience with the game to predict the outcome.

7 hours ago, Gnomezilla said:

Heartsbane and a hunter have equal value, I think. You could give Team Asylum a hunter instead of her, and have her be an interact target for all three crews as they fight to electroshock themselves or others. Or whatever else she does, I don't have her card memorized.

Also this puts constructs into two crews, and if you want to say the Neverborn have stolen Guild technology (I blame Lucius) swap their scion of black blood for the other hunter, put Heartsbane into the rail golem's crew instead of either hunter, now you have all three crews with constructs squabbling over who gets to order Hoffman to install their upgrades first. After all, once it's attached it won't be available again until that construct dies. Recycling!

This seems like it might be worth exploring further! I'm not 100% sure about the stone values, I don't have the cards at hand at the moment;

Team Grimwell
- Doctor Grimwell
- Hunter (7s)
- Orderly (5s)
- Orderly (5s)

Team Heartsbane
- Rail Golem
- Nurse Heartsbane (7s)
- Guardian (8s)
- Mechanical Attendant (2s)

Team Angel Eyes
- Angel Eyes
- Hunter (7s)
- Bloodwretch (5s)
- Bloodwretch (5s)

My only concern is that the rail golem is perhaps a tad too strong? His hit chance and defense are a great deal lower without Hoffman though, and the mechanical attendant seems pretty useless.

[Adran]

Remember that if you are playing a 2v1 game, the team of 2 have 2 leaders they aren't paying for, so the imbalance is less than you would expect. Also if they each have a full size hand, they they also have quite an advantage. (If you ahve them sharing a hand, then that might almost be a disadvantage against them, but if you only have 2 decks, then go with it). 

I think that the initial setup you proposed should be ok. I wouldn't say it was balanced, but I'm not sure which side would have the advantage, so for a fun game where you are just trying to the learn the rules it should be fine. 

[MR TORGUE]

Why not use the models under the Through the Breach RPG rules?

Would make for an interesting game with the models suggested. Especially if your playing the patients on the escape or a rogue neverborn agent.  I appreciate you may not have the books at such short-notice though... 

[Zedicius]

Right! I promised a quick report on how things went last saturday.

We voted and ended up doing a 1 vs 1 vs 1 king-of-the-hill type game. Having a non-insignificant minion on a center bit of terrain scores 1 vp on the next turn and killing an enemy leader scores 2 vp.

Things went quite well, actually! It was a lot more balanced than I honestly expected it to be. Friend A and B played Grimwell and Angel Eyes respectively, I played the Rail Golem crew.

Round one, the entire Rail Golem crew slogged along towards the center, moving an entire 8 inch forwards from a corner of the map. I was mostly just biding my time this round, getting the burning counter up. The first few activations between the other two players mirrored each other; A and B rushed towards the center. One hunter harpooned an orderly which was then dispatched by Angel Eyes, the other harpooned a Bloodwretch which was then dispatched by the remaining orderly. Player A had grimwell rush towards the center for a point, B did the same with the remaining Bloodwretch.

Round two, I had the Rail Golem come out swinging. Two locomotions let me charge Angel Eyes, hoping to end her. Unfortunately she survived with one wound remaining. Seeing the golem's surprise attack, A and B quickly decided to team up on the Rail Golem, sending Angel Eyes, Grimwell and a Hunter after the construct and bringing him down to only 3 wounds. I moved the guardian to the center for a point, hoping to use him to engage a bunch of enemy models on the next round. The mechanical attendant took a few pot shots but missed and Heartsbane was too far away from the action to be of much use, so I also moved her towards the center.

Round three, At this point the game was pretty much over. Player A won initiate, took down the Golem with Grimwell and then a near-dead Angel Eyes with his hunter; scoring 4 vp in one round. With 6 vp in total, we declared him the winner and ended the game.

Conclusion; it was my first 3 player game and most likely some tactical mistakes were made. Despite this, fun was had. In the mean time, my shipment has finally arrived so now I have 3 playable crews to mess around with!