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  1. Pergli

    NB Lucius - Trying to figure him out

    Queeg looks interesting for sure out of all the options because the 0s + allowing interact with 0 for ply sounds amazing. I was thinking the same thing about just running lynch but I think if you only bring the three models, its enough of the brilliance that you aren't relying on it. That's a fair point about using them as scheme runners, I hadn't considered that and I probably need some in my list. I'll have to play with them to see how they feel. Guild Guard is good too. 6 points for 2 models to protect lucius sounds nice but how often does he need a retinue? --------------------------- Also, I saw that Graves is the normal take with him but I'm not sure if thats the correct person anymore. He has a Ml 6 with 345 with his auto trigger being worthless. His Crushing Strike has potential and he is somewhat survivable. His pushes are pretty good but I think the investigator has enough push shenanigans it isn't as needed. The illuminated to compare without brilliance are Ml6 245 with a further threat range. They also have armor, built in regen + a 0 to heal. If you can get brilliance on a model with either their 1 ap range shot (using lucius) or the beckoner they become ml6 467 with the ability to cheat on neg flips with their trigger. You also get a higher Df + Wp model and because they are minions, they synergize with lucius + flips/horror duels + Issue command extremely well. Am I missing something on why Mr. Graves is better (I won't take Mr. Tannen, I don't think he has a place anymore)?
  2. Pergli

    NB Lucius - Trying to figure him out

    How does that work? The Winter Spear says Rg: Gun 8 or close 2. Elite training only benefits the close attack. I checked the FAQ but i may have missed it. I didn't even consider Queeg comboing with the claw and the rougarou with their 0s for free plus the free interacts. That makes him potentially worth taking. The Hans gunline looks like fun, how well does that work out?
  3. Hey guys, i'm trying to figure out Lucius with neverborn. I was told he wasn't very strong and coming from Nicodem to this is going to be a massive overhaul to my way of thinking and playing the game. I'm looking for any tips/tricks or cool combos that can be done. I've wrote up a few of ideas of what has been going back and forth recently in my mind for solid list building. Writing it down helps my thought process with this and if anyone has experience or better ideas/suggestions, please fill me in. Also, is there a neverborn FB group like there is for the other factions? Henchmen + Enforcers - Master Queeg looks situational with allows models to interact for 0 (ply for information or some scheme pools). - I know people love the Doppelgänger but i'm not sold on her with this crew. Just not sure whose abilities I'd like to take again other than maybe a beckoner but I can just use Lucius to accomplish this same idea without spending an extra 7 stones. - Emmissary might be fun. With all the pushes and his 0, it can cause a ton of walk duels and if you go minion heavy, the extra + flip can be extremely useful. Plus summoning changlings for more activation control sounds like fun. 10 points is a heavy investment but maybe not if its your only hechman/enforcer. I'm probably going to be focusing more on minions since that is where Lucius' strength lies. Guardsmen Investigator - I think these might be an always include for me. Free card draw + scheme/scrap/corpse removal is always solid. Allowing free pushes off the drops is also amazing especially since its once per activation. I could make a long list of all the various utilities i've thought about for this model with it's various pushes but suffice to say that it is probably one of the best models for board control. Austringer - I'm not 100% sold on this model but a 12 sh7 that requires no LOS and ignores cover is solid. Hide him behind a building and take pot shots at everything with no reprecussions. Also, you can completely drain an opponents hand on the first activation forcing them to change their plan to react to not having any resources is extremely powerful. Top that off with direct orders for the various schemes/strats or even the bultungin, it is almost an auto include for me. Guild Guard - Cheap filler units who are not insignificant and are df6 when other guilds guard are nearby. I think you have to take 3 to make this worth anything but that limits the options above. Guild Hounds - Also cheap filler units but are going to most likely be insignificant unless you bring more hounds. Their 1 ap charge when there are schemes can combo nicely. Especially with lucius using his ability to push them 3 inches and letting them take another 1ap charge. Not sure how useful or powerful it is but it sounds hilariously annoying. Brilliance Illuminated - I'm thinking 2 of these are going to be a staple in every list. They are solid models who can tank a ton of damage. Armor + regen + 0 heal means they will take punishment and be able to continue doing what needs to be done. Combining with the beckoner giving out brilliance, their damage spread becomes ml6 4/6/7 which is absurd for a 7 minion. Beckoner - Obviously pulls models into pounce range, illuminated charge range or hands out brilliance. Also a mimic which can help keep Lucius alive and my list runs very few mimics/guardsmen so this helps. Fae Bultungin - Probably another solidly powerful model to come out of wave 5 for this crew but not so much for anyone else (That I can tell). I doubt opponents will drop scheme markers within LOS of him but you have plenty of ways to get free attacks out of him. Investigator pushing him off drops, Austringer with deliver order and Lucius with Issue command (a 2AP attack and a 1AP attack for 1 master AP sounds solid) are the reliable ways I can see this going off in this crew. I'm sure there are others but something that pushes your own models is what is needed for this. Rougarou - Pounce also combos really well with this list and the fact that it can eat your abundant scheme markers to heal is a plus. Honestly, I have an issue with having too many scheme markers so I can't place more, this can help with that. The Claw - My top out of the 3 Autumn knight minions. Winter spear gives you a range threat and can drop schemes in base which again, combo for healing, lucius attacks or the investigator. Also has a 0 which can push models for extra pounce attacks. The Thorn - 0 push plus placing a scheme marker in base like the other fae. It's melee can give card draw which is always a positive in my opinion but the damage spread is low. Mimics I don't really see any power with any of the current mimic choices. Terracotta warrior - a 6 cost minion with 4 wounds. Sure, it can help with Lucius stone cycling but I don't think it's worth it. Vogel - i'm not sold on with this crew. Seems like fun if you go with a bunch of beasts but the beast that comes out is an enforcer so its not as useful with Lucius. Changlings - okay if you have the points for them or summon them but I can't seem to find the points for them. Guild Lawyers - Probably meh, barely looked at them. Fees might be interesting but I think the points are better elsewhere. Pretty much where I've ended up with my train of thought. I'm sure there are models i'm not considering which may have some use or cool tricks/combo but I'm not fluent enough with neverborn and how they play. Any help or guidance would be much appreciated!!
  4. Pergli

    The New Seamus

    With Sybelle, I was thinking you give her MLH and that gives her pretty much just one solid turn. The rest of it, meh. You shriek twice so two opponents have to focus her but they can't focus her from further than 3 inches causing them to waste AP or resources. Again, its only one turn you get this off. I really do find the idea of this Seamus as a good alternative for Nico. I love nico but there is so much salt (I don't even run the main nico list) that I need to play other things before my group lynches me. On Seamus, why would you take AKA vs Unnerving aura? Unnerving seems like it can be powerful for those models who either end up engaged with him or paralyzed. Paralyzed models are pretty much auto wounded with this upgrade or are points better spent elsewhere?
  5. Pergli

    Gravedigger op or misunderstood

    I've been thinking about running gravedigger in my nico list. It wouldn't necessarily grab every corpse marker that generates. Just 2-3 for the extra card draw. Also, it can counter pick other crews who are bringing models which deny your corpse markers. Finally, it could be a really fun corpse bloat bomb making mortimer less useless late game. 50mm base can catch alot of models within the aura. Also obviously if its nico v nico, you want to bring it so it can deny their nico corpse while providing for you. If they kill it, you muwahaha all the corpse that fall off of it before they can get them.
  6. Pergli

    No Gnashing In The Zone!

    Hmm okay so here is what i'm thinking: My standard list has: Nico, Morty (CB, MLH), Emissary (conlux of + flips on attack) Mortimer can be replaced with Asura. It's one less corpse marker on turn 1 but that means Nico can give whatever you summon fast or another one of your minions fast to make up the loss of AP. You could give Asura CB but I wounding her (assuming asura is a woman) is not optimal, even for a corpse marker. There also isn't a good 0 on her so MLH is no longer useful. I'm trying to figure out what upgrades to give her if any. Nothing is useful in terms of what is currently out. I'm sure there will be more upgrades later but not at the moment. Carrion Emissary... it's a toss up to me between the Nico specific conflux or the general one. Yes, it makes zombies hit harder. The attack will probably be Ml6 and potentitally Ml8. It sounds pretty amazing on paper but i'm not sure if it beats out + flips on attacks. Flipping 2 cards for lure, take your meds, take the lead or any of the hanged attacks is so good. Especially if you're flipping against someone who gives - flips to cast actions. I guess it comes down to how many zombies you expect to have in the game and how reliant you are on them. Also, the pro for the Nico conflux would be that there isn't a bubble for it vs the emissary having to babysit one or two of your minions. For me, +1/+2 on a 2/3/4 attack isn't as valuable as flipping an additional card on some of those more necessary abilities that allow you to break the game. BUT i'm probably wrong since i've only been playing for about 3 months
  7. Pergli

    No Gnashing In The Zone!

    It is going to be sooooo good. Extra zombies every turn + that ML 5 attack... yes please. Might actually replace my Emissary
  8. Pergli

    Completely New

    Pick up her box when you can find it, all of the models are great and useful everywhere. My base 50SS list is (right now anyway) ------------ Reva -Blood Mark, Guise of Death Vincent St Clair -Deal with Death Carrion Emissary - Carrion Conflux 2x Shieldbearer Nurse Dead Doxy (prefer over Rotten belles, but thats my preference) Necropunk 5SS I mix it up depending on the schemes and strategy but thats the overall list and it hits pretty hard. Keep the Nurse and Doxy/Rotten within 4inches of the Emissary so you can double flip for your Take the Lead or Drug them (choose which of the two options you want). Then the Emissary can fly over to the shield bearers to provide + attack flips if needed and he gives you an extra forward zombie to use for Reva/St Clair. Necropunk is required in pretty much all lists to scheme run. Can solo claim jump each turn by himself if left alone. If not, he can do any of the other scheme running pretty easily.
  9. Pergli

    Help against Asami?

    Good advice overall. So low WP = Summon in a hanged and focus her with them because WP Duels. Also, Reva is pretty good because she can force WP defense. The 2 summoning of Jorogumos wasn't really a distraction. Both came in with flicker 2 so they were going to be hanging out for awhile. I did panic a little bit. Having two of those on Nicodem turn 2 with no corpse markers is pretty daunting but I should have kept my head. I lost the game but had I not panic'd I could have came back. By the end of of it, I had gotten to the point where I could take the board back but it was turn 5 so it was a bit too late. Yeah, that first charge is what threw me off. You're right, I could have placed my shards a bit more effectively to prevent the charge. I'll look into that next time. I was able to kill Asami with a dead doxy by forcing the trigger on take the lead so she had negative flips to duels when defending. He burned all of his high cards on the jorogumos so I was able to punch her to death. Thanks for the tips!! ------------------------------------ I actually went back and was thinking about the game and I could have won or tied the game had I focused properly. Squatters rights, instead of focusing on staying alive, I could have ran the emissary to a corner point on turn 3 and used his shards to prevent him from making any moves over there. It also would have denied him "A Quick Murder" where the emissary was his target. Would have swung the game from 3-7 to 6-6 with just that small decision. Possibly even 7-6 had I done that turn 2.
  10. Pergli

    Help against Asami?

    Sorry, she summoned 2 Jorogumos at the beginning of turn 2, 1 in my deployment with nico and morty, 1 a little farther up to harass my emissary. Doing this made him sacrifice Ohaguro because I could then activate to finish off her last few wounds. I do run Nico with maniacal laugh and undertaker with LTM. Lots of card cycling, corpse marker protection (mobile too) and chain activate PZ is just too good to pass up. I lose out on protection but typically its pretty beastly and he doesn't die often. I'll look into Yin because that would be useful, which book is it in? Ohaguro, you're right. Just have to accept its going to be annoying and remove it as fast as possible before it can full heal. Hitting it with the hang's ability seemed to really help since she could no longer full heal after killing a model. Made her much less scary in general. Yeah, this guy saves those cards to get the summons off. Granted, its still a 13 to cast it but its brutal. I had Tail Em as my scheme and I had to choose between killing Asami off and losing out on schemes or letting her constantly summon things in. If I was in a better position I could have let her live to try to pull points off of her (should have done that since I was behind anyway) but I had to kill her to prevent myself from being overrun with flicker models. I wouldn't feel bad about running Reva against her lol. It's mostly about trying to get my Nicodem game stronger and learning the models better. Only been playing for about 2 months at this point so i'm still figuring things out
  11. Pergli

    Help against Asami?

    That was the plan until he summoned the spider and removed my corpse markers. I actually killed her turn 2 relatively easily in this game. Summoned a hanged turn 1 and knocked her down to half wounds with zero healing. Then killed her with a dead doxy. It just seems like a pain with her being so mobile. I didn't even think about sharding off the big spiders so then I could remove flicker. That is a solid point. Really going to need to buy that model because of the versatility of her. Just don't want to have to buy the whole box for her haha.
  12. Pergli

    Help against Asami?

    Does anyone have advice for playing against Asami? What models are good counters to her general list? He ran: Asami ohaguro AmanJaku River Monk Yasonori Not sure of the others because thats all which came into play for the most part. ----------------------------------------------- I run Nicodem exclusively (Have Seamus and Reva, I know Reva is broken but i'm trying to get better with Nicodem and work on understanding my various model's roles in a game). 1. Removing Corpse Markers when they summon to give extra flicker really hurts my summon count. It will also hurt Reva in general because she will only be able to attack from her new corpse marker. Will probably need to have her be a charging beat stick vs a caster who sits back and lays down damage. --- I am guessing I just need to either activated Nico first if there are 2 corpse markers out or save Mortimier for 2nd to last to spawn corpse markers. 2. Can't run Chiaki to remove conditions of "flicker" because of the upgrade Nefarious Pact. "Models within 10 inches, you can prevent a condition from being removed". --- Not sure what to do against flickering minions. Do you kill the "free models" or do you ignore them hoping they disappear? 3. Ohaguro is nasty: Hops between their summons (opponent jumps him to your side) and can even place in base with my summons. Then charging without LOS... makes my shards completely worthless so no Carrion Emissary for me. --- Only benefit is this model is in your face immediately so you can focus kill it? Also, Turn 1 MLH on Mortimier was the only thing I could think of to keep the charge off of him. 4. Jorogumo summoning is crazy. You need a 13 or RJ in your hand but my opponent summoned 2 on turn 2 in my deployment while discarding my corpse markers. It gets brutal pretty fast because they come in with flicker 2/3 depending on how many markers they take up. --- No idea what to do against these summons. When you have two just walking around stabbing things to death, life just sucks. Maybe focus Asami? Try to lure her close enough to murder her quickly? She seemed to go down quickly to my doxies once they were close enough. ----------------------- In that game, I definitely made some mistakes so i'm re-evaluating them to fix it. 1. Did not activate MLH on morty turn 1 so he got charged which allowed Ohaguro to push him back into my lines and then charge nico while keeping morty and him engaged. 2. Didn't think about them taking my corpse markers so I dropped 2 corpse markers from morty and then he took them immediately for a jorogumo which was engaged with morty/nico. I wasn't 100% on how that worked since it was my first time playing them. 3. Drop the emissary (it was a fixed list tournament) and throw in... idk for 10 points a good counter to this list. Everything else functioned fine. Game ended with 3-7, if I had taken an extra necropunk (or summoned like planned), I could have tied the game. I had zero strategy and my schemes were mispicked.
  13. Hey guys, I was looking for a more indepth type of tactica for a new player. I started about 2 months ago and have gotten in several games but I was trying to find a little more. Maybe something along the lines of: Outcasts have this master who can do this. You should avoid X or deploy like this. Something general but narrowed down per master maybe? It might be difficult because we have so many different masters with different styles also. Also, I couldn't find just basic things like the following: 1. How many SS should you have on a non summoner? How many on a summoner? - When is it worth to get that extra model instead of stones? 2. Creating a 50SS list - How many models is "enough"? - Should you have 1 scheme runner or two? - Do you need a Beatstick in every list? What about two? - How many support models is good to run or any? (Nurses, Belles, Chiaki, Malifaux Child) ---- I know this comes down to opinion but not sure if theres a general rule. 3. Should you have a all comers list and make a few modifications at a time depending on scenario? - If you choose schemes that don't require interact actions, should you drop your scheme runners or do they have a different place? 4. Synergy ideas - What kind of Synergies should I be looking for? -- I can run sebastian and get poison synergy but should I make that a focus on my list or just a small piece of it? -- Is it only worth it with McMourning? - What provides synergistic opportunities -- IE: Arcane Emissary allows you to have a 6 inch + attack flip for minion bubble 5. What kind of auras are out there? - If i'm going up against a heavy shooty list, what should I try to fit into the list? --IE: Sebastian because of his - on shooting attack bubble 6. Deployment - What are the deployment strategies that I should be looking into? Do I deploy right on the line to get there faster or are there sometimes advantages to not being right at the line? 7. Alpha Strikes - What kind of alpha strikes are out there for other lists that I need to be aware of? - Do we have an alpha strike? - How do you defend against X alpha strike? 8. Initiative? - When is it worth spending a SS to reflip initiative? -- obviously if you NEED to go first and they flip a 6, you have a 50/50 shot depending on the cards in your hand. -- Not sure if someone has done the math for this and posted it somewhere or if I should look into creating a chart? 9. SS use - When do you use SS for -- Preventing Damage (as soon as you take damage or later when you're closer to death) -- Drawing more cards -- Initiative (8) -- Adding triggers ------------------------------------- Maybe the above isn't that basic stuff and maybe as I play i'll work on a general guide to help other people. The reason why i'm thinking of this is because I used to play Warhammer Fantasy years ago and there was a site where people would math out everything for every unit and every possible opponent. They were massive guides that were dedicated to giving out as much information as possible in terms of helping people understand when to do X or Y. It was extremely helpful to the community and I was hoping there was something similar here Thanks! -Pergli